Third Drone Shot Down in Three Days in Romanian Territory

230 pointsposted 2 days ago
by _tk_
(english.mapn.ro)

278 Comments

cbg0

2 days ago

As part of the SAFE EU financial instrument Romania is spending a lot of cash on defense measures for drones and other armament[1]. Currently still relying heavily on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flakpanzer_Gepard for anti-air as well as fighter jets with air-to-air missiles, as these recent drones were all brought down by F-16s.

Aside from strategic targets, a lot of the civilian infrastructure is quite vulnerable to drone attacks as there's a huge border to cover and definitely not enough anti-drone tech deployed. An apartment building was hit months ago with no casualties: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/apartment-building-hit-...

[1] https://www.rheinmetall.com/en/media/news-watch/news/2026/06...

alephnerd

2 days ago

> Romania is spending a lot of cash on defense measures for drones and other armament

Some of this is going to be stalled - Romania was planning on deploying the Iron Dome [0] and Spyder [1] for AD which was going to be co-produced by Volkswagen in their German factories that were on the chopping block, but Qatar (Volkswagen's largest minority shareholder with 17% voting share) blocked that deal [2].

[0] - https://www.jpost.com/international/article-861770

[1] - https://www.calcalistech.com/ctechnews/article/sy1n3pcfzx

[2] - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-07-10/qatar-blo...

rjzzleep

2 days ago

Iron Dome is designed for protecting from home made rockets made with dung from the Gaza Strip. And according to research the main reason for the low casualty rate is actually the early warning. How exactly is it supposed to help with real missiles and drones?

How do these scams keep happening? Why doesn't anyone care how their taxpayer money is spent?

spwa4

a day ago

Exactly. Iron dome was designed for Iranian designed drones and missiles (designed with Chinese help). There is nothing "home made" about palestinian actions, or "the cause", not even the propaganda that it's all homemade. Built by Iran too mostly (again with Chinese help). These are the exact missiles raining down on European cities.

China even built in insurance (check what the fuel is for the more advanced rockets, then check if Iran can actually synthesize that fuel ... heh. Weird)

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-57092245

Oh and to add insult to injury, the big problem with both European and US air defense, being overwhelmed by numbers of drones and rockets, is something Israel has demonstrated how to deal with a dozen times. In fact this system was designed for that.

Therefore Iron dome, Israeli experience and Israeli tactics are exactly what's needed here.

But of course politics are more important than direct demonstrations and weapons fire showing exactly who Europe's enemies are. Sorry that I ever suggested anything remotely different. Apologies. Please continue.

alephnerd

2 days ago

> home made rockets made with dung from the Gaza Strip

Homemade bottle rockets are a 2000s era Israel thing. Now it's Ababeel, Mohajer, Shahed, Arash and other Iranian drones deployed in Lebanon, Iraq, Yemen, and Iran. The same kinds of drones being used in Ukraine and operated by Iranian personnel [0][1][2] that are also the same make as the drones shot down in Romania as well as Poland.

Ukraine also gave us intel linking Iranian strike capacity with Russia [3] and Russia has previously offered to stop giving Iran geoint and strike intel in return for the US stopping geoint and strike intel sharing with Ukraine, which the US rejected [4].

[0] - https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2026/03/10/8024839/

[1] - https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/11/07/7375314/

[2] - https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/10/23/7373119/

[3] - https://xcancel.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/2081074329115078813#m

[4] - https://www.politico.eu/article/putin-offers-stop-intel-iran...

iwontberude

2 days ago

For me, I just hope the country collapses and we spend the next ten years prosecuting everyone who caused this outcome and overthrowing the existing system. It’s inevitable with how brain dead leadership is throughout government and corporations. The relentless greedy morons have taken the yoke.

dragonwriter

a day ago

If the country has to survive and recover rather quickly, not collapse, for your prosecution scenario to be likely and effective against any significant share of the people who caused this.

ithkuil

a day ago

It's astonishing how many people really seem to think that total collapse / destruction of a system can be an effective way for fixing things

cbg0

a day ago

It's kind of a childish view of the world; The expectation is that all the "quality" people will rise up and fix the problems of the country, but my perspective is that the political class is just a reflection of the people, so the existing idiots will just be replaced by new idiots, unless you raise the average somehow.

thingswecantsay

a day ago

To respond to both you and the parent at once.

1. While dragonwriter's point is not entirely wrong, I also wouldn't say I agree either. Czar Nicholas was "prosecuted" quite rapidly after the russian revolution.

2. The problem, ithkuil, is if the population does not see any other way to effectively fix things. (System capture, pareto distributions, disenfranchisement, etc.)

As an aside, I created a new account for this vs. my normal because I've wanted to speak more openly than I can on a work-associated profile for a while now, I will be keeping this account lest anyone thinks it's astroturfing.

ithkuil

18 hours ago

I understand the _impulse_ of wanting to destroy the status quo. But it's immature reaction and it's very common in teenagers and young adults.

Most positive progress has been done via hard work, sacrifice and time; most basic rights that we all give for granted now have been achieved that way and not by violence and destructions.

Yes, there are occasional counterexamples when people had to get rid of dictators via violence, but that worked because gradual, grinding, collaborative progress under such rulers was not allowed.

What we're witnessing today is not that: we don't have a strong system that systematically represses people who have a different opinion and discuss new ideas; we have a system where people are increasingly immature and want results fast because their attention span is limited, take huge achievements for granted and are willing to burn everything down because they think it's a game and they have never lived under a civil war

_DeadFred_

a day ago

Yes, murder is easy after collapse. But murder is not a fix.

thingswecantsay

a day ago

That response disregards the thrust of my point, as well as the parallel to the famous quote "war is the continuation of politics by other means."

If a population does not believe they have more productive options, that is what will be left. This is often compounded when the existing powers have an easy time with murder BEFORE collapse, such that any moral prohibition would be hypocritical and self-defeating.

Let me be clear as well: I do not think Nicholas's murder "fixed" russia. I was precise in my wording, it was a form of prosecution previously unavailable to them. My point being that if things get bad enough, people care less about a long-term fix, and more about some semblance of recompense, and in some cases it may truly be the only option available to them to realize any concrete impact.

_DeadFred_

a day ago

You responded to

     'It's astonishing how many people really seem to think that total collapse / destruction of a system can be an effective way for fixing things'
with

     'Czar Nicholas was "prosecuted" quite rapidly after the russian revolution.'
as the only tangible you gave. Then this spiel on the people and desire for violence.

The current system works better than any previous system for redress. In fac the regime is having to bypass the system/break the system in order to get away with what they are getting away with. Destroying the system will not put them in their place. Breaking the system in fact gives them more of what they want. More power. More ability to abuse the current environment.

Taking us back to the previous system, and putting in the hard and mundane work of keeping it working is the much better solution if people want redress, not continuous 'we just need to break it a little more because feelz/it's simpler/our political class (that we could, you know, work to get voted out) suck (and all we do is whine about it)'.

thingswecantsay

a day ago

I feel like you're not reading my whole comment vs. picking pieces, or are conflating my responses.

I explicitly said I was responding to both parents, and enumerated my response to each. (To be evenhanded, I could also have been unclear that my responses were distinct)

My response to the post you quoted was '2. The problem, ithkuil, is if the population does not see any other way to effectively fix things. (System capture, pareto distributions, disenfranchisement, etc.)'

The comment you are focusing on, regarding prosecution, was in response to Dragonwriter's earlier post regarding feasibility of prosecution after collapse.

Your final statement implies that you took my statement directed entirely at the US system vs. at a generalized statement (Warning?) on when people see revolution as a legitimate option.

I chewed over and decided to not touch too much more on the US aspect because I think it distracts from the original point I was trying to make, but I will say statements such as: 'The current system works better than any previous system for redress' are apt to my initial warning, as the US is clearly in a period of local retreat, (both as I think you touch on elsewhere in your comment, and not for the first time in history, to be clear) especially if the redress you seek is against political or white-collar crimes, and addressing that requires urgency, awareness, and action, including Voting, as you say, that I worry I don't see with the proactivity that is needed.

scarecrowbob

a day ago

"Taking us back to the previous system, and putting in the hard and mundane work of keeping it working is the much better solution if people want redress, not continuous 'we just need to break it a little more because feelz/it's simpler/our political class (that we could, you know, work to get voted out) suck (and all we do is whine about it)'."

What, this actual system, where (even ignorign the deep violence it metes out to folks in other places) every fucking week I get to hear about how someone has been murdered by it?

It's rich to hear folks talk about "wannabe murders" out of one side of their face while ignoring long-term, violence that this system does every day.

XajniN

a day ago

It quite often is. “No man – no problem.”

_DeadFred_

a day ago

Bullshit. Crazy to see we have so many wanna be murderers among us on hacker news though.

sneak

2 days ago

F-16s with human pilots and a2a missiles vs cheap drones? That’s one hell of an asymmetry and doesn’t seem robust enough to handle 100x the scale.

uxhacker

2 days ago

Ukraine is using old training aircraft with a guy with a shotgun in the back shooting the drones down.

Just think the small Cessnas and pipers littered around that could be used for a similar task.

https://youtu.be/GrzzYTXgnMQ?is=zChAgYfc5ZEi25gt

Edited out bad grammer

doodlebugging

a day ago

Kinda reminds one of the evolution of the air war during WWI. Planes were used as observation platforms to gather intelligence about enemy fortifications and activities. They were more mobile than balloons and could gather more timely information. Both sides flew past each other just doing their jobs until someone thought they could drop a grenade or small bomb as they surveilled the other guy. Then aerial bombing started to become popular. Around the same time pilots armed themselves and would take pot-shots at enemy pilots, usually with sidearms. Before long machine guns were fitted to planes and synchronized with propellers and pilots were able to dogfight.

I think the next natural step in Russia's defense against Ukrainian drones countermeasures like this, shooting them down with shotguns, will be to arm the drones. Then it will be up to Ukraine to counter that threat and the cycle continues as always.

brabel

a day ago

The advantage of using a drone is that it is cheap to produce, but it needs to be really simple to stay cheap. Arming it with a machine gun that can target an airplane trying to shoot it down would be very expensive.

pantalaimon

2 days ago

Yea the Gepard seems like a much better fit for those cheap drones.

Unfortunately it's been long discontinued and it's successor Skyranger is still facing some technical difficulties as of recent reports.

numpad0

2 days ago

Yeah, something is preventing them from just putting a small autocannon onto a turret and firing it from a Python script on a laptop. Russian drones and missiles seem to be just straight flying kinds, and while there are reports of Stinger type missiles seen installed on them, there haven't been reports of them growing anti-mortar radars. Most of them shouldn't need guided munitions at all to deal with.

cbg0

2 days ago

It's not meant to. That's why Ukraine receives the support it does, because they take the brunt of it.

bell-cot

2 days ago

Yeah, obviously F-16's & humans scale very poorly for this. However:

- At one-a-day scale, political and risk considerations probably favor the expensive solution.

- Using F-16's reveals nothing about your current anti-drone defenses. (Yeah, it's also a real-world basic competence test for your air force - for better and for worse.)

- If your intel people want more data on the drones, an F-16 can haul a whole lotta intel-gathering equipment to the show.

- If you're dealing internally with some head-in-the-sand traditionalists dragging their heels on updating your doctrine/equipment/training to deal with drones, then "real world, right now" examples are probably useful.

(BTW - do the articles say "a2a missile" anywhere? F-16's typically mount a 20mm cannon, a cheap drone is not a hard target, and cannon rounds are dirt cheap by compare.)

nradov

2 days ago

Ukrainian F-16s have used cannons to shoot down some Russian drones. Cheaper than a missile, but a somewhat risky maneuver as it requires getting close at low altitude and possibly flying through the exploding debris.

https://www.zona-militar.com/en/2026/02/09/ukrainian-f-16am-...

bell-cot

a day ago

Thanks. With the relative speeds, I'd guess the Falcons would use an attack profile similar to ground strafing - letting them pass well above the cloud of debris. Any thoughts?

Also, Wikipedia gives a 3km effective firing range for the M61 - but it'd be no surprise if the F-16's standard targeting optics can't achieve that against small airborne targets.

nradov

a day ago

This video shows a Ukrainian F-16 doing just that along with reactions from a pair of experienced US fighter pilots. It seems they're shooting from closer than 3km.

https://youtu.be/xuriiDzSB5k

bell-cot

a day ago

Far closer, because (my impression) the F-16 has nothing resembling the targeting systems you'd want for this job.

Hopefully a decent defense contractor or few sees business opportunities here.

walrus01

2 days ago

URL appears to go to home page of RO military, another URL is: https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20260726-romanian-jet-sho...

jubilanti

2 days ago

Nice to see a France24 link in the wild, it is a very underrated news outlet

walrus01

2 days ago

France24 does a lot of very solid work related to one of my particular areas of interest in the Iran/Afghanistan/Pakistan region. It's also a great alternative to any US news sources even for news about what's going on domestically in North America (though the CBC has more breadth of coverage, for sure).

sunaookami

2 days ago

Just keep in mind that's literally owned by the French government.

Jolter

2 days ago

That’s probably a factor in why it’s able to maintain such high quality.

Though most French commercial media are not bad, either.

yls

2 days ago

I think it is not owned by the government, rather by the state.

In a democracy, how is this a bad thing?

sunaookami

2 days ago

>Since 2008 the channel has been wholly owned by the French government

Explain to me why reading news from the state is a good thing? Kinda shocked that people here applaud state-owned media (there is no difference between "government-owned" or "state-owned").

yls

a day ago

To me there is, government as "ops", where the media could be more biased, while the state is the more wholistic entity, owned by the tax payer.

Your comment makes only sense if you follow the narrative that state is bad, private companies good. In most European countries, we are rather happy with having a part of the media market owned by the state.

hyperman1

2 days ago

You have to read the news from someone, and each one has its own bias. State news has a well known failure mode as propaganda. But commercial news turns out to have its own failure mode, where emotion inducing content has bigger gains for lower cost.

The best advice I can give here is to mix different sources. As a Belgian, I have a few local newspapers and the VRT news for Belgium, NOS, BBC, CNN, and Al Jazeera, which are all checked at least weekly. Each one has its own blatant biases and blind spots. There are still big missing gaps, e.g. a Chinese and an African perspective. There is clearly Gell Mann Amnesia going on. Even so, I started to look very different to the world.

ceejayoz

2 days ago

I tend to prefer public media over corporate media. It’s not like the Murdochs are more trustworthy than Macron.

bananamogul

2 days ago

Interesting how people like it use sympathetic terms (“public media”) while those who don’t use pejorative terms (“state-owned”, “government-run”).

I’m not saying it’s good or bad, just observing the language.

inigyou

2 days ago

The former is euphemistic. The latter two are objective.

entrope

a day ago

Not in every case. I would call (in the US) National Public Radio "public media", but Voice of America "government-run".

I personally don't know enough about BBC or France 24 to go beyond "government-funded", so I would want more details about their governance before using the terms mentioned before to describe them.

yls

a day ago

Sarcasm?

In a democracy, how would state owned be different from public?

Do you also call libraries state-run?

IMHO both terms are heavy with bias depending on context.

inigyou

a day ago

Public means accessible to everyone. State-owned means owned by the state. These are orthogonal axes. X is a public square that is not owned by the state. The CIA situation room is owned by the state but is not public.

eth0up

a day ago

I think if certain books happened to not appear in that library, it being state-run might be something to consider.

What ever it truly is, America is called a 'democracy', and it had Project Mockingbird, which some, myself included, say never ended. And even being maximally fair, I must question whether democracy has any meaning in the context of media after Ellison buys half of it. Does he not own CNN? No point in mentioning who, or what owns Fox. And Bezos?

I know it comes off offensive, despite being unintended, but 'democracy' means nothing to me. We have some useful principles of it, which I value, but as a thing, I don't see it.

inigyou

a day ago

Alternative conclusion: democracy means something, but America doesn't have it

eth0up

a day ago

Yeah. And we seem to be missing a Republic too. Thank G0d for Chinese LLMs.

thisislife2

a day ago

> Explain to me why reading news from the state is a good thing?

When you get your news from RT, BBC, France24, DW, PressTV, NPR, Gulf News, DD, Al-Jazeera etc. you get "official" political propaganda from the respective governments that run these outlets. Political propaganda can be based on falsehood or factual truth(s) with a "biased" analysis on it. Government news outlets have to show some journalistic integrity to earn trust. Thus, most of their propaganda tends to be based on facts than on falsehood. So reading them all or reading about the same subjects from these different outlets really gives you a larger political perspective with some great political insights.

brabel

a day ago

As far as I know, it’s in the mission of most of these to give an unbiased report on what is happening in the world and inside the country. In practice, there may be influence by powerful politicians, but for these news outlets to spread government propaganda would constitute corruption.

I know that the BBC in the UK, SVT in Sweden, the ABC in Australia go to great lengths to listen to both sides, whatever they may be, to a fault. They are often criticized for giving minority views too much coverage for this reason, and rarely for saying what the government would want them to say uncritically.

thisislife2

12 hours ago

> but for these news outlets to spread government propaganda would constitute corruption.

You would think so, but that isn't the reality because journalistic "corruption" is judged on political ideology. Your whole notion of what is "corrupt values" is based on your political ideology. And one of the important roles of government news outlets is to propagate the political values that the country has adopted - that is why western media covers capitalism with a positive biases and disses on communism and socialism with negative biases (and vice-versa in say, Russia and Cuba). These political values are not examined neutrally by the media because the political powers have already termed one or other other as "corrupt".

Just look at the heavily biased (positive) coverage Israel receives in western medias. Western countries were imperialist powers and thus have no problem with Israeli zionism's settler-colonialists policies and the consequent repression of Palestinians. Where as the Global South, especially former colonies still remember what it was to be colonised by foreigners and thus are "biased" towards Palestinians. (Ireland is the exception in the west, with huge sympathy for the Palestinians, because it too remembers its oppression under the British).

brabel

8 hours ago

> These political values are not examined neutrally by the media because the political powers have already termed one or other other as "corrupt".

I don’t really recognize that when it comes to capitalism, plenty of criticism on the national media I know. Can you give examples of that bias?

I would say there are other examples of this though, for example when it comes to various wars where the country has taken sides: it becomes really difficult for journalists to openly defend the “enemy”.

throw1234567891

a day ago

Who are you getting your news from? “Fox quote on quote News”?

bobthepanda

2 days ago

A diversity of media is a good thing. Most of the bad things you could say about state media also apply to sufficiently concentrated private media.

M95D

a day ago

Commercial interests tend to progresively degrade the quality of the news if there are no state-funded news channels. They publish more and more unverified "facts", conspiracy theories, tabloid news, AI slop, AI images instead of real news photograpy, intrusive ads, etc.

When there's a news channel funded by the state (instead of ads), most other private news are forced to keep up the quality and they also have the opportunity to call out any bad news and biases published by the state channel. This way no news outlets stray too far from the truth or become unreadable slop. It's better overall.

snowpid

2 days ago

The government it can use its media to influence its citizen and try it to change election results or create propangada.

France is executive heavy democracy similar to US and Latin American States. This is a very big flaw and state owned media might be contribute to.

lcnPylGDnU4H9OF

2 days ago

What is the distinction between government and state?

As for your question, Russia is nominally a democracy but I wouldn't trust the veracity of their state media reports.

walrus01

2 days ago

> What is the distinction between government and state?

In a parliamentary democracy the "government" is the prime minister, president (whatever the titles are), cabinet ministers and the party that happens to be in power at any given time. The "Government" might be a coalition of 2, 3, or 4 medium sized political parties that have come to some sort of arrangement to have enough votes to pass a budget and laws. The "state" are the persons who perform the longer term functions of the state not directly controlled by the whims of any political thing that might happen in a specific year.

For instance when France made a decision to build its previous series of nuclear powered, missile carrying submarines, and the decision to build a new series that will enter service some time in the 2030s, that's implemented by the civil servants who run the state. Various political parties have waxed and waned and leadership has come and gone since the French nuclear program began, but various successor governments have continued it.

Less specific than that program, the state implements other basic services for the people of the country, all the things that have their day to day work done by people who aren't elected members of parliament. The parliamentarians who happen to be occupying various seats at any given time are the government.

In a more specific Canadian example: The government funding that comes to the CBC each year is actually from what would we would call the state. https://cbc.radio-canada.ca/en/impact-and-accountability/fin...

You'll see terms used like "the government has collapsed as the result of a non confidence vote" or "there's been a leadership challenge inside the government (eg: how Trudeau lost power recently)", it doesn't mean the functions of the state have collapsed.

mdp2021

2 days ago

> the distinction between government and state

The State would be the organization that uses governments as the branch of executive power (and also organizes a legislative activity, and a judiciary activity...). The kind and amount of power held by the Head of the State and the Head of the Government can vary.

kQq9oHeAz6wLLS

2 days ago

> In a democracy, how is this a bad thing?

Because democracy is effectively mob rule, which means minority voices may get shut out.

jfengel

2 days ago

Ah, but they were aware of that, and built in protections for minorities.

Which means that everything leads to the status quo, and the majority voices get shut out in favor of the most entrenched minority.

Those clever founders.

dredmorbius

a day ago

Advertising-funded media is inherently plutocratic, in which those with the most money influence direction. Sometimes more overtly than others.

There've been many treatments of this: Jerry Mander's Four Arguments for the Elimination of Television (1978), Edward S. Herman & Noam Chomsky's Manufacturing Consent (1988), Neil Postman's Amusing OUrselves to Death (1985), Hamilton Holt's Commercialism and Journalism (1909) <https://archive.org/details/commercialismjou00holtuoft/page/...>.

That last is particularly good for a number of reasons, including that it's short and information dense, and lays out the clear conflicts inherent to advertising-driven media just at the time it was first gaining influence, and at a fraction of its present size and influence.

If you prefer video, media critic Isadore F. "I.F." Stone gave an excellent 1973 interview on the PBS series Day at Night on the state of newspaper journalism in the United States, contrasting the relative independence of big-city dailies vs. rural papers. The former were large enough that no single advertiser could threaten editorial independence.

Link will offer a choice of instances to redirect to: <https://redirect.invidious.io/watch?v=qV3gO3zxQ1g> (video).

alt227

2 days ago

How is this any different to any private news outlet which might hold a bias?

petre

2 days ago

Yeah, just like the BBC is owned by the British government. Less clickbait and scaremongering, I guess.

mlinksva

a day ago

Including on the dimensions of (1) having a very fast website and (2) not having any paywalls. Feels very good to read.

ekianjo

2 days ago

Yeah a solid propaganda arm of the French government

renox

2 days ago

Not the only one though: I remember what happened when we 'invaded' Lybia: not one criticism in the French news anywhere, total censorship, even though our media had widely and correctly criticised the US for the Irak war..

So I think the best thing is to get news from everywhere Russia, China, the US, Europe, but that's a lot of work..

gabaix

2 days ago

It is also not possible as there is censorship in some cases. The European Union has blocked rt.com.

inigyou

2 days ago

That is blocked because far too many EU residents were taking it as 100% fact and acting upon it.

The block is only DNS level, IIRC, and doesn't affect VPNs.

walrus01

2 days ago

As compared to what more trustworthy, honest news sources? Please name a few, I'm curious.

happosai

2 days ago

Usually the argument is that because a reputable news agency with a history of high quality journalism made once a mistake, it's better to listen to some angry podcaster with a history inviting cooky nutcase, or sketchy Twitter account with history of boosting fake news as jokes.

ekianjo

a day ago

Two things can be true at the same time. The lack of good sources and the fact that france24 is pure propaganda.

close04

2 days ago

The home page shows 3 consecutive press releases for the past 3 days each detailing a similar incident.

The first drone on 24.07 took ~80min to intercept and shoot down, well into the country. The other 2 were shot down within kilometers of the border so they’re paying closer attention.

bestham

2 days ago

The asymmetry between the drones and the F16 neutralising them quickly makes this financially unsustainable.

lukan

2 days ago

Yes, but it also trains the pilots and everything around them for real action in a non war environment (you cannot just shoot anywhere in civilian airspace).

And they would need to train anyway.

But for a real conflict, sure, more economical solutions are on the way.

AnimalMuppet

2 days ago

I believe that Sun Tsu said something about using your enemy's military to train your military.

firefax

2 days ago

I think the idea is that you don't keep sending just one F16, but the problem is long before an age of drones we built up some catch me if you can bullshit where we expect smaller countries to ignore airspace violations.

Like bro... you got a GPS. Get the fuck out of here.

spiderfarmer

2 days ago

I love how people are pointing this out thinking NATO countries aren’t currently doing a Manhattan-light on drone defense.

themgt

2 days ago

It's not World War 3. It's just two increasingly overlapping unsolvable wars involving two increasingly coherent geopolitical blocs consisting of dozens of countries spanning three continents, most major nuclear powers holding 95% of global nuclear stockpiles and the vast majority of global military spending and resources, with nuclear-capable cruise, ballistic, and hypersonic missiles flying back and forth, attacks on strategic nuclear early warning systems, threats of nuclear first-use and global nuclear holocaust, etc. Fighting over issues the leaders of the involved superpowers and great powers have described as existential and beyond compromise.

Not World War 3 though, currently.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/jul/26/ukraine-war-br...

Llamamoe

2 days ago

Are there enough nations on Russia's side to call them a bloc? It seems like almost everyone is supporting Ukraine.

jfengel

2 days ago

India and China are both supporting Russia in various overt and covert ways. That's a huge fraction of the world.

Iran is even more closely linked. Arguably the real reason for the American attack on Iran is to reduce their contribution to the Ukraine conflict.

Plus Russia's various Toadies (which included Hungary, an EU nation, until recently)... It's a pretty sizeable bloc.

It's not yet an all out Axis and Allies situation, but it's definitely not just Russia against the world.

irishcoffee

2 days ago

India and China are the only reasons Russia hasn’t collapsed on itself yet. Much to the detriment of a country that had no interest in being invaded.

hebelehubele

2 days ago

> Arguably the real reason for the American attack on Iran is to reduce their contribution to the Ukraine conflict.

How nice of Trump and Netanyahu, thinking about the world peace and Europe's well-being.

jfengel

a day ago

While they are clearly leading this war for their own purposes, both require the support of a governing apparatus (the Republican and Likud party bureaucrats) who have their own motivations. Those motivations are not necessarily positive, but can at least be understood in terms of a national policy rather than individual temper tantrums.

dylan604

a day ago

> individual temper tantrums.

whatever the rationale for starting hostilities against Iran, the situation we are currently in is best described as an individual temper tantrum.

shigawire

2 days ago

China is a bloc unto itself

pessimizer

2 days ago

The only nations against Russia are in Europe, or run by absurdly corrupt right-wing dictators. The problem with supporting Russia is that the US is psychotic, aggressive, and takes pride in causing civilian casualties. It will starve your children to death as a openly proclaimed tactic; it loves to double-tap. Russia isn't going to hurt you for being neutral, but the US will, joyously.

Europe doesn't even really support Ukraine, it just hates Russia for defeating it in WWII. Thank God France has nukes, or Germany would be invading it again for not showing enough support for Ukraine and Israel.

edit: Poland is starting to remember what the Ukrainians did back then, too. And to notice that the psychotic Ukrainian nationalist minority (that we funded and armed) are proud of having done it, and would do it again.

azan_

a day ago

It's not Ukraine that regularly threatens Poland. Russian propaganda is truly only for absolute brain dead - how can you at same time fantasize about bombing Warsaw, jam GPS over Baltic, do hybrid war across Polish-Belarusian border and say that actually Ukraine is the real danger. Unfortunately there are lots of people that are stupid enough to actually believe this.

bluegatty

a day ago

No, it's not that complicated - one country invaded another - that's it.

One is a nuclear power, so the reaction is not what it would be otherwise.

This is the same as Russia invading their neighbours like they have since Peter I.

fractallyte

2 days ago

russia's invasion of Ukraine is absolutely solvable. It's just a disgrace that Ukraine is left to do it alone, with huge casualties (civilian as well as military), and inconceivable destruction.

nesarkvechnep

2 days ago

I hope they don’t send any to Bulgaria. Our PM is waiting exactly this to declare we’re joining the Russian federation.

AnimalMuppet

2 days ago

How are Russian drones entering Bulgarian territory going to give the PM the chance/excuse to join Russia?

GTP

2 days ago

I don't know if this is their case, but some politicians don't care much about their arguments making sense. In this specific case, a politician could either claim the drones come from some other country, and Russia is going to protect them, or that they need to join Russia for them to stop.

koiueo

2 days ago

There's no logic behind russia's pretexts.

In 2014-15 they started shelling civilians in Donetsk and Luhansk regions, then used that as a pretext to increase their military presence by pretending it's all local militias fighting back the shelling the ruskies themselves started.

The pretext was fully fabricated, the militias theatre was fully fabricated. Nothing made sense. To anyone with a pinch if intellect the truth was obvious...

Yet, the legend of Ukrainians murdering other Ukrainians for using russian language has rooted so much, even now some ppl believe that bs.

In case of Bulgaria, ruskies could attack, then attack again pretending russian-speaking population needs protection in the light of the first attack.

And right-wing nutheads in EU gonna believe that, and blame NATO for offensive expansion

No

Logic

Whatsoever

blagie

2 days ago

That's not really accurate.

Russia's pretexts were largely true.

Ukraine did ban Russian language schools. That's technically a human rights violation. Native language education has been considered a human right since the late 1800s.

It's a common violation. Belarus did the same thing for Polish, Poland for German. Etc. Lots of Muricans want Murica to be an English-language Christian nation too, and laws sometimes reflect that. Certainly Murican education standards favor English speakers.

Euromaidan was a bit anti-rule-of-law.

Many Russian minority groups were mistreated in Ukraine.

All of that is true.

None of it merits an invasion.

Best propaganda is usually all true but selective of facts. In any group of more than a million people, some will do something bad. There are instances of Poles assaulting Ukrainian refugees, and vice-versa. It sounds bad, but with over a million refugees, it's statistically impossible for it to not happen. It makes for good propaganda for Russia too; both sides are starting to be riled up.

Good propaganda has elements of truth. Even if you read Hitler, you'll see a mixture of truth and fiction. The verifiable facts lend credence to the fabricated ones.

The dumb thing is Ukraine has doubled down on all of that since the invasion. The right thing to do would be to:

1) Open up a Russian-language elementary school

2) Don't mention Bandera, or better yet, apologize to Poland and open a park recognizing Polish victims or something similarly symbolic.

That's the right thing to do, and with that, the credibility of the propaganda simply disintegrates. If you're ever falsely accused, the trick is to do the exact opposite.

adrian_b

a day ago

You are right that the Russians have been frequently somewhat mistreated in the former Soviet Republics where they have become minorities.

However, this is an extraordinarily hypocritical claim, because this has followed a time when for various durations, between a half of century and two centuries the Russians have mistreated the minorities of those places in a much more ferocious way, inclusively by robbing them, murdering them or sending them to forced labor in Siberia.

In Ukraine, there are many places with Russian colonists who have been installed after WWII in the houses that before the war belonged to various other nationalities, which were then killed or dispersed to Siberia by the Russians.

Yes, Russians have been mistreated after the separation of the Soviet Republics, but this is much, much less than what their fathers have done around WWII and before it, and many of them have still inherited what their fathers have stolen from the other nationalities.

Had the Russians treated better the others when they had the power, they would have not been so hated, so they would have been much more likely to be treated correctly.

koiueo

a day ago

> Yes, Russians have been mistreated after the separation of the Soviet Republics

The fuck you're talking about?! Mistreated how?!

Give a specific example

blagie

a day ago

That's missing the point.

When a toddler does something inappropriate, "but he did it to me" is not an excuse. If both kids did something bad, I want both to apologize, and both to move on. It's also not a contest for who did something worse. I want Ukraine to apologize to Poland. I want Poland to apologize to Ukraine. I want both nations to move on.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

Indeed, that's doubly the case when it's nations -- a civilian hit in a retaliatory strike often has nothing to do with an atrocity. I don't know where you are, but I'll pretend the US. If someone whose father died in Guantanamo, or whose child was killed in an airstrike in Afghanistan, killed your mother, would they be "right"? Would it be hypocritical of you to complain?

Or if you want to punish a dictator, does it make sense to starve the people in his nation -- most of whom probably want him out even more?

I am perfectly aware of all of Russia's wrongs. You missed most of the big ones, from holodomor, to about a half-millennium of other torment of people in Ukraine.

You try to do right for your own soul. Apologizing doesn't weaken you.

And you don't punish children for the sins of their fathers.

ithkuil

a day ago

> Best propaganda is usually all true but selective of facts. In any group of more than a million people, some will do something bad

This seems a trivial detail but I think it's a profound mechanism of the current disinformation climate

azan_

a day ago

What you've listed here is not what russia lists as a reason for attacking Ukraine. And even if it was, it's still really shitty pretext.

koiueo

a day ago

Where are you from?

You see, I've been in Ukraine in 2014, and I've been observing everything from the front seat, so to say.

Generally what ruskies say does not matter. Not a single word.

But specifically, the pretexts they may be stating now (I don't follow what they say), may be different from what they stated in 2014.

It baffles me that after so much bs spewed by russian propaganda, people waste their effort trying to synthesize a coherent story.

The only rock fact: ruskies say whatever gives them tactical advantage at the moment.

api

2 days ago

As with many conflicts this one goes back a long way. Ukraine gave up its nukes to Russia in exchange for a non aggression pact that the invasion broke.

Also bad for the world. The lesson, as with Iran and Iraq, is: you’d better have nukes and never give them up. This is the opposite of the lesson we want if we want to contain proliferation.

The global taboo on use remains. If someone breaks that and gets away with it we are into civilization ending danger territory.

somenameforme

a day ago

Ukraine never had its own independently controlled/operated nukes. The USSR deployed nukes on various territories but all command and control was completely centralized within Russia. Ukraine/Belarus/Kazakhstan returned the Soviet nukes to Russia under the same agreement and received some nonbinding assurances and cash in exchange - it was nothing like a formal pact. Had any of these countries tried to reverse engineer the nukes, they'd likely have been invaded by the US, Russia, and most other major world powers, so it was largely an offer they couldn't refuse.

Russia claims those assurances ended with the US actively advocating on the ground in Ukraine for the overthrow of their government in 2014, as the assurances included not interfering in domestic politics or using economic coercion. But the US also sanctioned and was working to overthrow Belarus as far back as 2006, so those assurances had been pretty much dead for a long time.

Outside of that I completely agree with everything else you said, especially with people not appreciating how far back these conflicts go. The whole Bandera stuff has no real parallel in the West, so I think most people wouldn't really be able to 'get it' even if they had the facts, which they overwhelmingly do not.

adrian_b

a day ago

Ukraine had the nukes in physical possession and they had enough expertise to eventually disassemble them and replace the electronics.

Choosing to not do this to avoid a hypothetical external aggression was a bad choice, because they were invaded anyway.

somenameforme

a day ago

This isn't like Russia just shut off the lights. The control systems are designed specifically and solely to make it impossible for a third party to steal/activate the weapons, so I think simply assuming that Ukraine could achieve such is unjustified.

And Ukraine's where they're at today because of bad decisions. Russia's negotiations to end the war started on literally day 2. And they involved absolutely no land concessions or anything like that - the big issue was not joining NATO. Such offer would now be labeled a crushing to defeat for Russia, given how the war is going.

koiueo

19 hours ago

> Russia's negotiations to end the war started on literally day 2. And they involved absolutely no land concessions or anything like that

You've been there, right?

And do you know the meaning of the word "literally"?

Jeez, you russian clowns.

somenameforme

11 hours ago

The war began on February 24th. The first face to face meeting was on the 28th. By March they basically had a treaty worked out with nothing but details remaining to sort out. Then Ukraine chose to abruptly end the talks following the intervention of the West, allegedly Boris John in particular.

There's a somewhat reasonable timeline of the talks themselves, til their end here. [1] But the NYTimes is being a bit disingenuous. The early talks called for the recognition of the independence of Donbas, but under Ukraine. The contested regions were to be given a special status, probably akin to something like Chechnya under Russia or perhaps Puerto Rico under the US. So Ukraine would control these regions, but simultaneously they'd have a significant degree of autonomy and independence. In any case, by March even this issue had been withdrawn.

[1] - https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/06/15/world/europe/...

mopsi

4 hours ago

  > Then Ukraine chose to abruptly end the talks following the intervention of the West, allegedly Boris John in particular.
Didn't happen. You keep repeating a misquoted soundbite from one of Ukraine's negotiators.

David Arkhamia said that after the Bucha massacre was uncovered, western governments stopped pressuring Ukraine into halting the war at any cost (including surrender). This was Boris Johnson's message too.

Russian propaganda put a spin on it, misrepresenting the "reduction of western pressure on Ukraine to surrender" as "western pressure on Ukraine to fight". This supports the overall propaganda narrative that Ukraine is resisting the Russian invasion only because they are forced to by foreign governments, and not because they want to be free, independent and, not live under the Russian boot.

That's all the substance there is behind this "Boris Johnson forced Ukraine to fight" story.

api

18 hours ago

No an entire nation state plus likely EU or US cooperation could certainly not reverse engineer some Soviet Cold War era electronics. Lol.

somenameforme

12 hours ago

Even in the present times it's unlikely either of the US or EU would want Ukraine anywhere near nukes, but that was even more true in the 90s. Prior to this war the West itself had been engaged in endless propaganda against Ukraine that was largely identical in message to what Russia used when invading. Here's [1] one article among countless you can find with such, from a USAID connected guy no less.

[1] - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary/...

dust42

2 days ago

> As with many conflicts this one goes back a long way. Ukraine gave up its nukes to Russia in exchange for a non aggression pact that the invasion broke.

From the Guardian (12 days ago): "Kyiv’s decision to honour second world war fighters who killed about 100,000 Poles has revived simmering tensions". Bandera was a Nazi collaborator and today's Ukraine politics worships Bandera. Lots of streets are renamed to honor him. Eastern Ukrainians are considered second class - or as some politicians said: "There are 2 million people too many".

The US (look up Nuland and her quote about 'fuck the EU') fueled with $5B the nationalism in Ukraine. Now imagine, the US would fuel with $50B the nationalism in Belgium and the the flemish would attack wallonie. You know what would happen? France would support the wallonie. Nothing to see here.

koiueo

2 days ago

1) there are plenty of russian schools in russia

2) Poland is not your concern, Vasily

ifwinterco

a day ago

That's the point he's making though - this kind of response just validates Russian propaganda, makes Russia look good and makes Ukraine look bad.

If you want Ukraine to win the information war then this isn't that helpful?

Unless of course you are actually pro-Russian and you're just playing this game at a higher level in which case... congrats because that is effective

ithkuil

a day ago

Are there Ukrainian schools in Russia?

EDIT: I won't pretend to know much about the history of the conflict. But the thing that made me lean towards supporting Ukraine was the widespread Russian rhetoric that "Ukraine doesn't exist, the Ukrainian language doesn't exist, they are just Russians". Such imperialistic attitude and the resulting asymmetry is incompatible with any attempt to shame Ukraine at not being perfect in the treatment of Russian minorities in Ukraine. All while ukrainian children are kidnapped and resettled in Russia to become Russians.

koiueo

a day ago

Don't waste your time on russian trolls. As soon as you start arguing with them, you lost (your time that is, nobody cares about opinions usually).

But since you seem to care

- there were russian schools even after 2022. No one was closing them the way the troll implies. Anecdotes are not the evidence.

- ask the troll how many Ukrainian schools are in russia, and whether that's a violation if human rights.

- ask the troll, why ruskies burn Ukrainian books on the territories they occupy, while Ukrainians after 2022 merely donate russian books to libraries.

You see, that's how russian trolls operate. They pull a fictional story out of their ass, and "invite for a discussion".

And while you waste your time trying to prove anything, they

- loot your country

- destroy your culture by precisely targeting museums, universities

- murder your people

- r*pe 6 yo kids

Maybe ask the troll what does he think about all that.

I know what he'll answer, so I'm not willing to waste any of my time. I would've responded differently elsewhere, but I want to keep visiting HN under my account.

blagie

a day ago

> Unless of course you are actually pro-Russian and you're just playing this game at a higher level in which case... congrats because that is effective

I seriously thought this was the case, but looking at the post history, it's probably a question of Hanlon's Razor.

Poster appears to be Ukrainian, and clueless.

Russian trolls feed on these types, unfortunately, and they end up polarized quickly enough.

That's the amplification in these disinformation wars.

koiueo

a day ago

I admire anyone who has the energy to fight on the informational front, but I think that's mostly pointless. People who haven't decided on their stance in this war are a minority.

We have IMO, an informational stalemate, with russians having much better positions, unfortunately, thanks to their network of agents covering entire planet, and huge investments over the last two decades (and even before that: the entire Bandera horror-story is their work from soviet times, because Bandera been fighting russian soviet colonizers).

Those a bit smarter have figured that you can not trust a single word coming from russians. Their methods have been studied, described, and presented.

Those who keep repeating russian propaganda, will continue doing so until russia is defeated militarily (and I'm not saying that's gonna happen soon, or even during my lifetime, those folks in EU better prepare).

blagie

6 minutes ago

You seem to be a product of Russian propaganda.

My advice would be to read a non-Ukranian history book.

What Russia seems to be doing is trying to split Ukraine from the West. It's not true that "russians having much better positions, unfortunately, thanks to their network of agents covering entire planet." They don't have that scale. They do seem effective propaganda in Ukraine and in Poland.

Right now, it seems to be working. Russian propaganda leads to Ukrainians are acting like dicks, and international reactions to Ukrainians. Literally, all they need to do is this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rE3j_RHkqJc

That's what they're doing, and it's working.

US split off a year ago. EU is turning away. Polish support went from wholehearted, to holding their noses and helping. That's not a result of false information elsewhere, but within Ukraine. Ukrainians -- including politicians who ought to know better -- walk around talking nonsense which fully supports the Russian propaganda.

Right now, you're helping Russia win.

Proper history: Bandera absolutely fought for Ukrainian freedom and independence. He absolutely committed murders, terrorism, and atrocities to do so. Some of those were targeted at Poland, who now took in over a million of your refugees, and put itself at risk to give massive military support. Volhynia was 100,000 Poles killed -- about 0.5% of the Polish population at the time. Many of those were woman and children, and few had anything to do with destruction of churches or whatnot. You're glorifying him, while asking children of his victims for aid.

(As a footnote: No one cares if this were 10,000 or a million. Telling Poles it's 200,000 and Ukrainians that it's 40,000 is exactly a way of driving a divisive wedge on what's a non-issue at this point; everyone agrees it was a metric fuckload)

People like you are not much different than Southern Americans, who talk about the civil war about state rights, omitting slavery, or Germans who talk about post-WWI reparations, without mentioning the holocaust. Yes, WWI reparations were devastating to Germany. No, that didn't merit genocide.

Right now, the important problem is to get Russia out, get Crimea back, etc. For that, you need allies. Swallow your fucking pride, and learn proper history. Every nation that has had one of these events has to go through it, or else they fracture, like America did racially.

Russia's goals of keeping Ukraine out of the EU and NATO? All they needed to do is rile up a few folks like you with nationalist disinformation. Boom. Ukraine did for Russia what they couldn't accomplish with weapons.

This isn't hard to solve. But it requires swallowing pride, and coming to terms with a rather more complex history than presented in Ukrainian nationalist curricula.

paganel

2 days ago

> we’re joining the Russian federation.

Based PM, from one of your neighbors just North of the Danube.

Sabinus

a day ago

Why not just move to Russia yourself? Live under a strong traditional leader and culture.

paganel

a day ago

Waiting for our liberators from the Western yoke right here in Bucharest, you've got a problem with that?

Sabinus

2 hours ago

I wouldn't recommend that strategty. EU-NATO defence spending is increasing and having the front-line pass over you is somewhere between an extremely harrowing and a deadly experience. You can immediately (and reasonably safely) get the strong and traditional ruler you want by just migrating over. Russia says they respect national minorities, and they offer incentives for workers willing to migrate. What's stopping you?

azan_

a day ago

Why would you want to join third world shithole?

Insanity

2 days ago

Given how poor their Ukrainian war is going, this is a strange move. I guess it’s mostly just posturing?

Waterluvian

2 days ago

The logic I’ve heard is that one of the more palatable defeat conditions for Russia is that they’d rather lose to NATO than Ukraine. So they’re fine to push limits because even the worst case scenario gives them better options.

znnajdla

a day ago

This. Losing to Ukraine is a massive humiliation. Losing to NATO is “fair” in their eyes. Even now, pro-Russian sources refuse to believe the current drone swarms and highly advanced deep strike drones wrecking havoc on Russian oil infrastructure (see the official state of emergency declared in Crimea and fuel shortages in other regions) are caused by Ukrainian drones. They keep making up some sore loser nonsense about these being NATO drones or some clever trick like drones released from trucks inside Russia. Meanwhile even the Pentagon is buying Ukrainian made drones: https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/ukraine-a...

bluegatty

a day ago

No - Putin believes he can win, this is to scare NATO.

He's not wrong - this is a war of attrition and Russia is about to raise 500K-1M soldiers - if they can do that, and keep Ukraine on their backs, it's possible Russia could break through.

Unlikely but possible.

Ukraine has difficulty recruiting and equally high desertion rates.

'Eventually something has to give'.

I think it's unlikely and that Ukraine will be able to hold out.

tremon

15 hours ago

> about to raise 500K-1M soldiers

Russia has developed necromancy?

Tade0

2 days ago

Having seen posts in social media by the usual suspects from previous such incidents, it's a way to convince the audience at home that the enemy (NATO) is actually weak and that there's no need to be alarmed.

cbg0

2 days ago

It offers valuable information on response time.

cingraa

2 days ago

These are cheap decoy foam drones with less electronics. The amount of fuel decides how far they fly. Favorable wind? They fly further.

embedding-shape

2 days ago

> The amount of fuel decides how far they fly. Favorable wind? They fly further.

Is this true for non-decoy non-foam drones and basically everything else that flies, even things with solid boosters? Seems like a strange part to add here as it basically applies to aviation in general, replace "fuel" with "stored energy" and literally all type of "vehicle" fits basically.

yorwba

2 days ago

A non-decoy drone would presumably go no further than its target, at which point any leftover fuel just adds to the fireball. Whereas making a decoy drone go down before the fuel is exhausted is pointless waste, when instead it could be decoying a little bit longer.

vixen99

2 days ago

They are cheap but the rockets to shoot them down cost (I've heard but don't count on it) around $480,000 per missile. That is not a minor consideration for a country like Romania.

cbg0

2 days ago

Absolutely not the ideal weapon to fight them, and better(cheaper) options are coming to shoot down the drones, but until then the price is irrelevant as long as you're preventing loss of human life.

jstanley

2 days ago

Saving any nonzero amount of lives for any unbounded cost is not necessarily a good trade, if there are ways to save more lives for the same cost, or the same number of lives for a lesser cost.

Kinrany

2 days ago

The actual volume here is tiny, so the costs pale in comparison to political and economic consequences

cbg0

2 days ago

We're not at the point of making those kind of decisions in Romania, fortunately. Politically right now it would be very dangerous to say that "some of you may die".

inglor_cz

2 days ago

It is ye olde reconnaisance by the tip of the bayonet. How long can you prod before someone says "ouch!"

For the case of a hot war, knowing the detection and destruction capabilities of your future enemy is valuable.

azan_

a day ago

Deescalation by escalation is a standard russian tactic.

benj111

2 days ago

They've been doing this for years.

I don't know if it's to try and circumvent Ukrainian defenses or to provoke a reaction to sell to domestic audiences though.

petre

2 days ago

Putin's only option is to escalate at this point, otherwise he's seen as weak with the war going so well. The Romanians should also be really getting their act together and start shooting the bogeys down.

Turkey didn't think twice before shooting down a Russian Su-24 in 2015 for violating Turkish airspace for about 17 seconds. This is how you "negotiate" with the Russians: first you break their nose when cross some red line, then appologize.

kspacewalk2

2 days ago

The Turks never apologized to the Russians. They said the incident was regrettable. Which is consistent with the overall "don't fuck with us" message that was being sent.

mike_hock

2 days ago

Move by whom? Drones straying from the intended route is usually caused by jamming from the other side.

Escalating tensions between Russia and NATO is in Ukraine's, not Russia's, interest.

JoelMcCracken

2 days ago

You’re missing the fact that Ukraine desperately needs missile defense, and these incidents incentivize its neighbors to keep all their defenses to themselves.

No one wants to be blamed when they can’t defend themselves when Russia attacks.

rciorba

2 days ago

If NATO as a whole responds, yes it's in Ukraine's interest. If the NATO response is weak and non-cohesive, it is a victory for Russia, demonstrating article 5 isn't worth the paper it's written on. Let's see how things play out. So far we're in "small, plausibly deniable provocation" territory, but if this follows the "salami slice" M.O. we would expect Russia to keep slicing if they feel there's not enough push-back

mike_hock

2 days ago

NATO not going total war over a few airspace incursions does not prove a lack of resolve to defend its territories. Russia is also not salami slicing its way to anything if it's not causing meaningful damage or territorial exchange.

Conversely, Russia(n leadership) would probably love an overreaction by NATO to unlock the use of its conscripted army for "defense," which is not feasible in the current war of aggression.

malfist

2 days ago

To strip away your rhetoric, you are saying it is Ukraine's fault for Russian drones flying into Romania.

mike_hock

2 days ago

The only loaded rhetoric is coming from you, I merely stated what the incentives are. Note that the situation is somewhat symmetric in that Russia also has an incentive to misdirect Ukrainian drones toward NATO airspace (which has happened).

exDM69

2 days ago

> misdirect Ukrainian drones toward NATO airspace (which has happened).

Claims to such effect has been made in public by reputable persons but they are not very credible nor has any supporting evidence been shown in public.

Drones getting lost due to GNSS jamming is happening.

But intentional misdirection towards a target would require GNSS spoofing capabilities over an impractically large area and that the drones would be susceptible to simple spoofing. They have satellite navigation, inertial navigation, terrain following cameras and listen to ground based radio sources like cell towers and are designed to operate in hostile RF environment. Just sending a fake GPS signal (several of them) won't make the drone divert to a specific target or direction.

I'm not buying the misdirection story until more compelling evidence is made public.

mike_hock

a day ago

I made no claims as to whether misdirection is happening or feasible, only that there are incentives for both sides to do so if it is, while there are no incentives for Russia to take on a much larger enemy while it can barely handle Ukraine, which OP was implying was the obvious explanation.

cbg0

2 days ago

To counter this conspiracy of yours: Ukraine was in a much poorer position in the past and didn't resort to this type of jamming with the hopes of dragging NATO into the conflict. Today, they are in a much stronger position, striking deep into Russia and even the Caspian sea https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/iran-says-ukrainian-att...

an0malous

2 days ago

Why are these drones so easy to shoot down, but the ones invading airspaces over nuclear bases and other sensitive installations hundreds of times for months all over Europe and the east coast of the US were never shot down or tracked even once?

Kubuxu

2 days ago

Because Shahed 131/136 are large, way larger than surveillance drone/quadcopter. We are talking 2-3m wingspans and 130-200kg launch mass.

infinite_spin

2 days ago

One other reason, Shahed drones are preprogrammed with their target, they're not being flown by an operator who can quickly change their course. They're basically a cruise missile with propellers.

bluegatty

a day ago

Different types of drones.

These are Shaheds - big, slow, dumb, you can see the coming.

The one's over Europe were sneaky little FPV drones, like consumer grade ones, launched by FSB people nearby.

gus_massa

2 days ago

I guess because the have an explosive payload and it's better to take them down before they reach a populated area.

The other drones are probably not going to cause an explosion (unles they colide with a plane) and are already in a populated area, so it's risky to destroy them.

gcbirzan

a day ago

They are all just as easy to shoot down, if you're willing to spend half a million dollars doing it. When you're Romania that hasn't been fighting a war for years and you get one a day, it's trivial to shoot them down. When you get tens to hundreds a day and you're Ukraine, it's harder since you cannot afford to use F16s and sidewinders to shoot them down. And even if you do, you cannot shoot down all of them, but when you just get one a day, it'll be a while until the 95% interception rate gives you a miss.

Oh, wait, Romania actually got hit by one. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93x4nxlkjeo

It's just a matter of numbers, both percentages and money.

rolisz

2 days ago

There are many more that are missed in Romania :)

wat10000

2 days ago

Because those weren’t drones, they were people noticing for the first time that there are airplanes in the sky.

an0malous

2 days ago

Dozens of sensitive military bases, nuclear facilities, and airports reported incursions and some shut down their air spaces in response, are you saying the Air Force, NORTHCOM, and airport air traffic control don’t know what airplanes are? The Coast Guard and NJ state police also reported sightings and even pursued some of the drones.

wat10000

2 days ago

Yep. Officials aren't immune to mass hysteria, and there's immense pressure to assume the worst "out of an abundance of caution."

"Having closely examined the technical data and tips from concerned citizens, we [DHS, FBI, FAA, and DoD] assess that the sightings to date include a combination of lawful commercial drones, hobbyist drones, and law enforcement drones, as well as manned fixed-wing aircraft, helicopters, and stars mistakenly reported as drones. We have not identified anything anomalous and do not assess the activity to date to present a national security or public safety risk over the civilian airspace in New Jersey or other states in the northeast."

Either they were wrong about the nature of the sightings when they happened or they were wrong afterwards, there's no world in which they got it right the whole way through. So the only question is which way they got it wrong. I see no reason to believe that they were correct in the moment and wrong afterwards.

ozarkerD

2 days ago

Because they were being flown by their respective governments.

an0malous

2 days ago

They shut down their own airports and military bases because their own craft were flying over them?

cmiles8

2 days ago

We seems scarily only one rogue actor or screw up from WW III in Eastern Europe and the Middle East.

fc417fc802

2 days ago

Don't we already have that? It's just a smoulder instead of a conflagration.

xedrac

2 days ago

Do you feel threatened that Russia and Iran will succeed in conquering all of Europe and the Middle East? I see it more like a couple of misbehaving misfits. That's very different than say, WWII.

azan_

a day ago

But they don't have to succeed, invasion of Baltic countries could potentially be enough to start WW3, even if russia does not have capacity to win it.

justin66

2 days ago

> I see it more like a couple of misbehaving misfits.

Those zany kids!

andriy_koval

2 days ago

> Do you feel threatened that Russia and Iran will succeed in conquering all of Europe and the Middle East?

Iran has a strong stance to significantly increase influence in the Middle East if not restrained: they have many way (not just Hormuz) to project power on oil countries, and essentially force them to switch sides.

AnimalMuppet

2 days ago

How about WWI? This feels more like the start of that - blundering toward catastrophe.

dh2022

a day ago

This situation does not resemble the beginning of WW1. wW1 was caused more or less by an inept leader (the Herman Kaiser Wilhelm) with way too much power.

Putin cannot play the part Wilhelm played in 1914 because Russia has very little power.

Xi Ping cannot play the part Wilhelm played because he is too smart (he is one of the shrewdest and smartest leaders rn). If Xi Ping starts to lose it, then yeah, we may have WW1. Until then this is a very different situation.

AnimalMuppet

a day ago

And President Trump?

tim333

19 hours ago

There are a lot of similarities between Trump and Wilhelm but even so the situation is not like pre WW1 really. Then you had a number of warlike alliances rearing for a fight. Now you have basically Russia attacking it's neighbour and NATO not wanting to fight much at all really. I mean they will if they have to but they are not going to bomb Russia because of the odd stray drone.

mcv

2 days ago

The main threat to Europe is if Trump ever makes good on his threats to take Canada and Greenland. If the US turns truly hostile, then Europe has a serious problem. Especially if Putin and Trump decide they want to split Europe between the two of them.

It's a very extreme case, but it would get extremely messy. Putin on his own is something Europe should easily be able to handle as long as they've got Ukraine on their side. Trump's erratic disruptive attacks will hopefully end at some point. I'm not worried about Iran at all, except internally.

hdgvhicv

2 days ago

Fortunatly Trump won’t be a major problem for long. I’m more worried about the techbro community who want to usher in a neo-feudal empire based around resource control.

mdp2021

2 days ago

> problem for long

Seen the news of the past hours about the 2028 intention?

flohofwoe

2 days ago

Trump is 80 years old. He won't be long for this mortal coil, or at least his brain won't (arguably it already isn't).

mcv

2 days ago

When has lack of brain activity or even being dead ever stopped them? See also the weird situation with Mitch McConnell.

FpUser

2 days ago

>"Putin on his own is something Europe should easily be able to handle as long as they've got Ukraine on their side."

500+ million people and corresponding economy needs Ukraine to protect themselves? this is just plain pathetic or what's worse proof that the EU would fight Russia to the last Ukrainian

inglor_cz

2 days ago

Well, not even the Nazis managed to permanently conquer Europe, but the destruction they still wrought on the continent was enormous.

Even a victorious war is destructive. I'd like to do without, but I am just a random hobbit in this regard.

hiddencost

2 days ago

Where the misbehaving misfits are the aggressors, i.e Russia, the USA, and Israel?

jcfrei

a day ago

People keep bringing WW3 up but I disagree. There's such a huge aversion in EU countries against any kind of war against Russia and the governments know it. They will let a LOT slide on Russia's side before any kind of retaliation (and I mean by force) is coming. Russia could probably kill several service members with a drone, claim it was an accident and the only thing coming from Europe would be a stern letter, some more sanctions and telling off the ambassador (and the Kremlin knows this too).

tim333

18 hours ago

I mostly agree but there has been a lot more coming from Europe than stern letters. They've sent a lot of weapons to Ukraine, funded more, and intercepted Russia's fleet. That could and likely will get stepped up.

zer00eyz

2 days ago

That is the point of these "one offs".

My read on the situation is that Putin knows that he's stuck, and baiting nato into some (likely tepid) response gives him an excuse to expand the next call up / draft.

TiredOfLife

2 days ago

Hawe you been in coma? There has been a ww2 sized war in eastern europe for 4 years

wk_end

2 days ago

A "World War" probably isn't characterized by its "size" (whatever that means) but rather by the fact that the combat theatre extends over much of "the world", or that much of "the world" are active belligerents. Ukraine is right now a localized conflict; I don't think it counts.

FWIW, as one potential size metric: casualties in Ukraine (so far) are comparable to the Korean or Vietnam War, and an order of magnitude less than the World Wars (even though the world has roughly 4x the population now than in 1939). It's much more comparable to those conflicts than either of the World Wars.

preg_match

a day ago

All major (and some minor) world powers are invested in this war in some way. China, Iran, India, the US, Russia of course, Europe. By population that's a lot. By power or influence that's also a lot. I think the main difference is the overt-ness. War has changed a lot since WWII, was have a lot "safer" and longer distance tools, including financing. Financing is way different now, it's instant for starters.

cenamus

2 days ago

Russia has had more casualties than the UK/US/France combined in WW2

wk_end

2 days ago

British, American, and French deaths made up only a small fraction of the 60M-75M killed in WWII, which speaks to the global ("World") nature of a World War.

I believe it's also the case that more Vietnamese died during the Vietnam War than the UK/US/France combined during WWII as well.

quickthrowman

2 days ago

No, there has not. One state is using a substantial amount of resources, US and others are donating EOL equipment and pocket change and Ukraine is managing to hold back the country expending a lot of resources. WWII had multiple global powers shift their entire economic output to war machines.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war

dvduval

2 days ago

The big part that I didn’t see was whether this was a Russian drone or Ukrainian drone

rwmj

2 days ago

They're Shahed drones, used by Russia.

romaaeterna

2 days ago

In September the Russians accused the Ukrainians of having repairing downed Geran drone airframes at the Lviv LORTA plant, transferring them to Yavoriv, and launching them unarmed into Poland. They presented various evidence like serial numbers, photographs of silver-tape repairs, claims that a Ukrainian SIM-card was used, lack of impact destruction, etc.

What's true though? I don't believe that I have a way to find out.

arcticfox

2 days ago

Russian credibility is at ~zero IMO. They've put forth so many insane theories related to this war that they started.

And just on first principles, how stupid would the Ukrainian have to be to do such a thing to their biggest ally? It almost beggars belief.

daliz

2 days ago

The Nord Stream destruction was made to Europe by their big friend Ukraine.

cbg0

2 days ago

A safe option is to avoid trusting an aggressor, which has no business being in Ukraine and that can pack up their bags and leave at any time.

tim333

18 hours ago

Usually you can find out. There are probably radar records showing them coming from Russia. But people aren't that interested and it's hard to keep up with the firehose of falsehood coming out of Russia constantly.

olexsmir

2 days ago

Shahed drones are used only by russia and iran

ur-whale

2 days ago

> I didn’t see was whether this was a Russian drone or Ukrainian drone

From the france24 article:

> A government investigation reportedly identified the first of the three drones as a Shahed model used by Russia in its war with Ukraine.

miohtama

2 days ago

Because Russian's war with Ukraine is unsustainable, something has to change for Putin for him to remain in power, and one option is an escalation with NATO.

Some other scenarios also explained in this good video

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jDhYFSGkaAc

GTP

2 days ago

> one option is an escalation with NATO.

Wouldn't this make the situation much worse for Russia, and therefore for him as well? The oligarchs will know who is to blame if Putin starts a war with NATO.

8note

a day ago

war with nato means he can more easily convince the russian public to go along with mobilization

russians arent excited to go die in ukraine, but defending the homeland from NATO is a different story

cbg0

2 days ago

The oligarchs aren't the ones controlling Putin, it's the other way around. But yes, escalation with NATO is a very poor idea, given Russia's struggles with a single non-NATO country.

GTP

2 days ago

I belive it's the other way around only up to a point. If the situation gets too bad, I believe they have the resources to overthrow him.

miohtama

2 days ago

Regime security for Putin in an escalation/mass mobilisation situation is high. The chances of the Russian economy surviving are poor.

WJW

2 days ago

Often economic crisis leads to less regime security, not more. Why would it be different in Russia?

miohtama

2 days ago

Watch the video in the link and it is quite well explained there.

FpUser

2 days ago

>"something has to change for Putin for him to remain in power, and one option is an escalation with NATO"

I think us couch experts including author of that particular video have no fucking clue what he will do and what the true state of affairs is. Had all those expert prediction materialized Russia would've already disintegrated 10 times and Putin would've lost power in a first months.

Mistletoe

2 days ago

Luckily being 73 and in what appears to be poor health can’t last forever. I can’t imagine spending my twilight years being one of the most hated people on the planet, but the head of the USA and Russia seem to have no issues with that.

“Father Time is undefeated.” - LeBron James

Jolter

2 days ago

Hoping for Putin to get sick is unhelpful. Trump is still in power well past 80, after all. We would do better to plan for a future where Putin rules Russia for another 10-15 years.

adabyron

2 days ago

Trump is 80. Putin is 73.

petre

2 days ago

The poor health thing "Putin is sick" was a FSB psy-op. Maybe he's sick in the head but otherwise in good health.

icantevenhold

2 days ago

He does look a lot better than his American counterpart

alt227

2 days ago

Putin is a lot more careful about the image he projects and his public appearances than trump.

simonh

2 days ago

Why would Putin want people to think that Putin is sick or infirm, and his ability to lead might be compromised? His entire schtick is that he's a strongman leader and the only reliable option in Russia.

petre

a day ago

It's basically targeted maketing. They pretty much wanted the West lethargic and unreactive at some point early in the war. Like "don't bother sending aid to Ukraine because Putin is kicking the bucket soon" kind of a narrative.

In Russia yes, they project the strongman narrative.

simonh

a day ago

I’d have thought the effect would be the opposite. Support Ukraine because it’s only going to be a short war, as Russia will be giving up soon, so why let them get conquered?

anticodon

2 days ago

What? In other words, you're saying: "Russia is losing war with Ukraine, so it wants to start a second front with bigger enemy".

Also, how's Ukraine war is sustainable for Ukraine? It's economy is non-existent (almost 100% dependent on western donations), it has less than 50% of population of 2022 (they don't publish any population stats directly, but if you combine available statistics, there are about 10-15 millions left most of them old retired people or young people that are too young to send them to the front lines), they are losing territory every day.

This is some weird "Ukraine is winning but front is moving in the wrong direction" logic.

kasey_junk

2 days ago

A war doesn’t need to be sustainable for Ukraine, it’s existential. For the aggressor that backstop doesn’t exist. They could literally stop the war anytime they wanted so they need to continue to prove it’s sustainable to keep doing it.

leonidasrup

2 days ago

Not all wars have a simple way to say who is winning, who is loosing. See the Vietnam war, different Afgan wars.

mcv

2 days ago

Ukraine is gaining some ground, but very slowly. It's basically a stalemate. Except that Ukraine is making the war extremely costly for Russia with the recent attacks on refineries and other targets deep into Russia.

As long as the EU keeps supporting them, I think Ukraine will be better able to maintain the current situation than Russia. But Ukraine is nearly as exhausted as Russia, and I think a European coalition sending real practical ground and air support would help a lot. I suspect sufficient support could force a breakthrough in southern Ukraine an liberate a very large chunk of land very quickly.

The reason that's not happening is either that NATO thinks this would give Putin the excuse he needs for large scale mobilisation, or simply because Europe is afraid to get its hands dirty. I don't think the former is nearly as big an issue as some believe; Putin has never needed any action from NATO or EU members to justify escalation, and has never responded to imagined red lines getting crossed.

The latter is more likely. I think Europe needs to remember the sacrifice that Canada and the US brought to liberate Europe in WW2, and recognise the moral obligation that creates to liberate others in a similar position. Like Ukraine today.

miohtama

2 days ago

It has turned out to be luck in disguise when Trump stopped weapon deliveries to Ukraine. Because Biden, Trump, and the Germans set all kinds of limitations so as not to strike Russia. For the first three years, Ukrainians were defending with one arm tied behind their back.

Now, when they finally can damage the Russian economy enough to make the war unsustainable for them, there is a chance we can get an end to this confict.

CapricornNoble

a day ago

> Ukraine is gaining some ground, but very slowly. It's basically a stalemate.

Ukraine has been gaining some open fields, while losing major urban areas. Kostyantynivka just fell and Russian troops are securing the high ground overlooking the Slovyansk-Kramatorsk urban conglomerate. Pokrovsk also fell faster than expected, suggesting that Ukraine increasingly lacks the infantry manpower density to defend urban terrain.

> As long as the EU keeps supporting them, I think Ukraine will be better able to maintain the current situation than Russia.

European support doesn't rectify Ukraine's critical vulnerability: manpower...or a lack thereof. Although Euro governments seem like they might start deporting military-age Ukrainian males back to Ukraine so they can be forcibly conscripted....because sending men to their deaths against their will screams "Western liberal values", or something.

> I think a European coalition sending real practical ground and air support would help a lot

Russian analysts have been coming on Western alt-media outlets warning that Russian hardliners are increasingly advocating for striking logistics and military production sites in Europe. HistoryLegends has a good video about how France, one of the more experienced and expeditionary European countries, absolutely struggled to even get a brigade into Romania for an exercise. Europe could definitely send air support.....but do you think European citizens are ready for their cities to eat Oreshniks (at a minimum) as a response?

> I suspect sufficient support could force a breakthrough in southern Ukraine an liberate a very large chunk of land very quickly.

There isn't enough combat engineering vehicles in all of Europe to clear lanes through the Surovikin Line. The Ukrainians already learned this the hard way in summer 2023.

mcv

a day ago

> Kostyantynivka just fell

Has it finally fallen? Because Russia has been trying to take it for ages now, against staggering losses, and keeps claiming they control it when it turns out they don't. They do that a lot. Mostly because they desperately want to have good news to report to Putin. They are advancing, but incredibly slowly, and at enormous cost, and Ukraine regularly does take land back.

But you're absolutely right that Ukraine is short on manpower, unlike Russia which seems to have endless reserves of people to send to very rapid deaths. Ukraine is doing a lot to fill their manpower gap with drones, but their lack of manpower is exactly why I think Europe should come to their aid.

CapricornNoble

a day ago

> They are advancing, but incredibly slowly

Their tactics have settled to extremely-small infantry infiltrations across almost the entire frontline. Warfare has evolved and concentrated mechanized assaults have been abject failures for both sides; it's far too easy to mass fires than it is to mass maneuver forces (see additional commentary (1) at the bottom). Russia's ground strategy is probably the least-risky way for them to keep pressure on the defenders and husband their own resources.

> their lack of manpower is exactly why I think Europe should come to their aid.

Be the change you want to see in the world: https://ildu.mil.gov.ua/news/how-join-armed-forces-ukraine

(1) Normally I would blame both air forces for lacking the capacity to systemically disrupt the defender at all depths.....but if we look at the Israeli aggression against Lebanon, the Israeli air force has total air dominance and their heavy mechanized forces are still struggling to advance. FPV drones basically quadruple the range of every ATGM team at 10% of the price.

tclancy

2 days ago

I think you’re misreading the comment and conflating Putin’s survival with the current war. I believe the OP is saying the administration can’t keep selling the war with Ukraine as a good idea indefinitely and will need to pivot to something more marketable. In our Internet-shaped world, everything is entertainment. This particular show has run its course and needs a pivot, add new actors, make a Very Special Episode or kill off one of the main characters.

talkingtab

2 days ago

Do not bother with the youtube video.The essential ideas is that Putin could scare European Countries into surrendering Ukraine. This video legitimizes that scare tactic. Nor does it deal with the underlying issue, which is that like Hitler and Nixon, Putin believes he is infallible. As a result the world as he sees it and the world as it is will continue to diverge.

fractallyte

2 days ago

On the contrary, the video gives an excellent analysis of Putin's options, and it's definitely worth watching.

You're right that Putin believes he's infallible, and the Nielsen makes the point that Putin often picks the most stupid option. But it also emphasizes that Europe needs to be ready to act if Putin decides to escalate, and if the US chooses to abandon NATO.

cingraa

2 days ago

Does not pass the smell test. The Youtuber has an axe to grind. Also, tracking in the URL.

Why make it more difficult if the current situation is unsustainable? Does not make sense.

Eupolemos

2 days ago

> The Youtuber has an axe to grind

It is Anders Puck Nielsen who is a serious military researcher and commentator. He is a go-to by any television channel in Denmark and has been from the start of the war.

He very much passes the smell test :)

miohtama

2 days ago

Removed the copy-paste tracker.

beaker52

2 days ago

“Dear Mr Putin, Please don’t use our airspace to attack Ukraine else we will be forced to write you another slightly more strongly worded letter next time. Thanks, NATO”

petre

2 days ago

Time to expell some more Russian embassy staff.

sneak

2 days ago

AIUI Russia has been regularly intruding into Finnish airspace and has often penetrated the land border with Georgia.

It’s one of those “let’s see how much we can get away with” probes to try to establish a new status quo. I wonder how Russia would respond to NATO drones doing the same.

squidbeak

2 days ago

Turkiye demonstrated how to stop this a decade ago - shooting down the trespassing bogey. It worked.

esseph

2 days ago

Drones shot down in Romania, Poland, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Finland, etc.

These are probes. Judging responses and response times.

Rumor is Polish GROM have been inside Russia for months.

Edit: See sources in my comment below. I bring receipts.

topspin

2 days ago

> These are probes. Judging responses and response times.

Some, yes. Many are merely defective units. These weapons are being manufactured in enormous quantity and deployed rapidly with minimal quality control: based on the reported numbers over Ukraine, the net manufacturing rate is about 10 per hour. Inevitably, some are defective and fail to follow waypoints. Romania is on a line through numerous targets in Ukraine from the Kursk region where many Russian drone flights begin, so Romania ends up being the unintended destination.

The good news is that the defects likely represent resource problems for the manufacturers. The same phenomena has been noted with increasing failed missile launches from Russia.

notathrowaway51

2 days ago

Can you elaborate on the last sentence? It sounds crazy.

Kubuxu

2 days ago

There are rumours that Polish GROM has been taking “vacations” in Ukraine. As in “we cannot officially approve your presence there but we won’t stop you either”, from the government.

gattr

2 days ago

I watched a related Chris Cappy video the other day:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RBY1cY-GF8

> Poland's elite GROM commandos have become legendary (...) in this episode, we explore (...) the covert war between Poland and Russia, and why Polish-speaking commandos are appearing inside Russian territory.

matkoniecz

2 days ago

yes, it is a big [citation needed] for me

esseph

2 days ago

See gattr's comment above

Basically GROM getting "leave" and then ending up with their whole team inside Ukraine as "contractors", just with deniability.

https://militarywatchmagazine.com/article/polish-mercenaries...

Regarding efforts to provide deniability for their operations, a Polish officer informed him: “we worked out a formula for our presence in Ukraine … we were simply sent on paid leave. Politicians pretended not to see this.” The Polish Volunteer Corps has appeared to use the same model to provide cover for the mass deployment of Polish Armed Forces personnel, who are technically former personnel when entering the theatre, with their presence having for years been widely reported on multiple frontlines. In February 2026, the lower house of the Polish parliament adopted legislation to provide legal cover to Polish citizens who fought in the ongoing Russian-Ukrainian War.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2026/07/03/russia-pla...

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2026/07/12/8043770/

https://abcnews.com/International/wireStory/baltics-poland-w...

Edit:

Added: https://youtu.be/5RBY1cY-GF8?is=rVFFKVnBxkmsF9aM

Pic: https://x.com/intermarium24/status/1659954927299440641

cingraa

2 days ago

Occam's razor. Decoy drones with a bit more fuel or favorable wind.

paganel

2 days ago

It's all a sham so that we, Romania, would be dragged into this war. That will only mean the end of the comprador regime currently ruling over us, but until then most probably many of us, Romanian men, will get killed "defending" the Western regime. Such is life, i.e. requiring sacrifices.

comrade1234

2 days ago

With the heatwaves and drought in Europe it's probably not the best time to have flaming wreckage falling from the sky.

squidbeak

2 days ago

Hasn't it occurred to you that typically when an explosive drone reaches the end of its flight, it, er.. explodes? Or that if it isn't shot down, that the last moment of its flight might kill people?

M95D

a day ago

Romanian here, living close to the border (~30km). There are no big forests nearby - we're safe. Some wheat fields might catch fire, but sometimes we do that intentionally anyway.

cbg0

2 days ago

It's never a good time to have flaming wreckage fall from the sky.

pixl97

2 days ago

Some things are relitive. It's never a good time to have 10 people get killed by an explosive drone, but that may be better than a million hecter fire that kills 10,000.

cbg0

2 days ago

The comparison is not really relevant in this case, as the area over which the drone is destroyed was taken into account on all three drone events.

bell-cot

2 days ago

The France24 article says the drone was shot down over the Black Sea.

PunchyHamster

2 days ago

...as opposed to it hitting the fucking target ? what are you smoking?

officialchicken

2 days ago

What does this have to do with startups?

firefax

2 days ago

>What does this have to do with startups?

You know, I used to have this style view when reading and commenting Slashdot, pre-9/11 about anything other than "the tech".

Afterward, in high school, I began to feel that understanding the foundations of geopolitics can help you maintain an advantage in the business world.

infinite_spin

2 days ago

Not much, but it's interesting and I think a large population of users here are curious about drone tech

cbg0

2 days ago

Check out the first paragraph: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

lucianbr

2 days ago

> Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, or celebrities, unless they're evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic.

Seems ths qualifies in spades.

mdp2021

2 days ago

The "interesting new phenomenon", obviously, is the potential of the generalization of what expressed in the title. It has very evidently both relevance to intellectual curiosity and a potential of impact on our activities.

lucianbr

a day ago

> The "interesting new phenomenon", obviously, is the potential of the generalization of what expressed in the title.

Why is this thing so difficult to name and you need to describe it in such a roundabout way? "Drones might be shot down a lot"? It's neither new nor an intellectual curiosity. "Drones are used for war" also not. It's been happening for years now. What is so interesting? Can you name it without references to generalizations of expressions of other references?

mdp2021

a day ago

> Why is this thing so difficult to name and you need to describe it in such a roundabout way

Because it is a multifaceted thing. Where, how, how much, why, what next... And the rest of the "W"s.

Read the posts: we find them interesting.