pr337h4m
6 hours ago
> In April, another protester hurled a petrol bomb at the house of the company’s chief executive, Sam Altman.
"protester"
GJim
5 hours ago
Somebody who protests violently is still a protester.
You and I will disprove of their illegal methods, but that does not change who they are.
chrisjj
4 hours ago
> Somebody who protests violently is still a protester
Somebody who uses violence is not necessarily a protester at all.
sheikhnbake
2 hours ago
Violence is a valid form of protest, especially in the context of violent oppression.
The appropriateness of violence in the context of AI companies can be debated.
But invalidating violence as a means of protest entirely is naive and silly.
frumplestlatz
5 hours ago
More accurate would be “rioter”, “terrorist”, or “insurrectionist”, depending on the specifics.
surgical_fire
5 hours ago
Every revolutionary was a terrorist before the revolution prevailed.
watwut
5 hours ago
Insurrectionist is getting ahead of the time, Altman is not technofeudal lord yet.
vrganj
5 hours ago
All of those are political labels. One person's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.
GJim
5 hours ago
If anyone is fighting for my freedom, I'd rather object to them targeting civilians old boy.
surgical_fire
5 hours ago
Let's not pretend Altman is a random innocent bystander.
We may object to someone trying to get him to a state of incandescence as an act of unjustified violence, but Altman is definitely a member of the tech elite, something as close to aristocracy as we have in our times.
How the future will have written the current events, I cannot say.
frumplestlatz
5 hours ago
No, terrorism is defined by their methods and targets.
I wish I could say I was shocked by the dangerous radicalization you’re exhibiting, but it’s increasingly the norm.
piva00
5 hours ago
There's no consensus on the definition of terrorism though, and it's so broad that you could use it for calling any kind of violent protest as terrorism.
A thing to keep in mind: when people feel they have no voice they inevitably will resort to violence for their political aims. It's just a fact that terrorism, in its broadest sense, will happen if powerless people don't see any other possible avenue for their political opinions to be taken into account.
vrganj
2 hours ago
Let's look up the dictionary definition of terror, shall we?
> violence or the threat of violence used as a weapon of intimidation or coercion
> especially : violent or destructive acts (such as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/terror
Now, this could apply to, say, US actions in the Middle East, Iranian actions in the Middle East, MAGA riots, these protesters, the anti-Nazi Resistance and Yugoslav Partisans, pro-Nazi violence in pre-Anschluss Austria, the Suffragettes, etc etc.
Which one you cart out the scary label for is merely a reflection of your ideological biases. Amongst the same notes, the radicalization you see in others can be read as a reflection of what has already become normalized in your mind.
soco
5 hours ago
For my understanding: aren't "terrorists" meant those who target random bystanders to make a point? In this particular case Altman is no bystander (but his family is).
vrganj
6 hours ago
Is it only protest if it is meek and ineffective? Polite and easily ignored?
frumplestlatz
5 hours ago
We’re talking about a petrol bomb hurled at someone’s home.
vrganj
5 hours ago
Yup. We are talking about it, precisely. It seems like the protest worked in getting attention and mindshare.
If they had just shown up with a sign, would we be talking about it? I suspect not.
frumplestlatz
5 hours ago
We’re talking about far-left (in this case) radicalization that needs to be stamped out, and which directly feeds the reactionary right.
I don’t give a shit about their cause. They lost me and anyone else that’s moderately sane when they firebombed someone’s home.
You should research the violent political environment of the Weimar Republic and how it directly paved the road for the NSDAP’s ascension to power.
The solution to violent radicalization is to shut it down, not to normalize political violence that undermines law and democracy.
vrganj
an hour ago
The reactionary right needs no more feeding, its belly is already full.
I studied history in a state that used to be part of the Nazi empire. I know how they rose to power. The key factor was von Papen, a weak conservative who enabled them, vaguely the equivalent of establishment Republicans today.
I can also tell you that the pre-Weimar warnings ring a bit hollow when we already have some post-Weimar circumstances, like far-right paramilitaries patrolling cities and shooting dissenters.
Political Violence has already undermined law and democracy. Right now, ICE goons are brutalizing a Latino family somewhere. Right now, a war with no democratic backing rages on - a war that has already seen a school bombed.
Why is it that one dude bombing a CEO's house is worthy of so much more condemnation than the above? That, to me, feels like a more interesting question to answer, because of what it says about the ruling ideology and how it's normalized its own violence.
user
an hour ago
watwut
5 hours ago
Far left radicalization is necessary to counteract right wing radicalization that directly caused it. The right wing radicalized first and right wing millionaires put a lot of money into supporting that radicalization.
Left wing is just starting to react.