French firefighters face 'pyrocumulonimbus' for first time

210 pointsposted 10 hours ago
by saaaaaam

87 Comments

Dibby053

4 hours ago

For context on why this region is burning so easily: the Landes and Médoc are huge, artificial pine forests created in the 19th century under Napoleon III to drain and reclaim what was considered an inhospitable wetland, where shepherds famously walked around on stilts. Pine resin and needle litter makes it exceptionally flammable, and being an uninterrupted monoculture on flat land it lacks natural barriers to stop the fire from advancing.

artisinal

3 hours ago

Might be time to revert it back to wetland.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

Sounds like a good plan to me.

Probably a dozen reasons why we cannot that I am unaware of, but from my arm chair it looks good.

coldbrewed

2 hours ago

The water was likely redirected for agricultural purposes and the farmers won't/can't surrender it on top of drought, if it's anything like the US. Would be real cool if we could make investments like this though.

zekrioca

25 minutes ago

Let it burn then?

ornornor

5 minutes ago

People live there. So do animals and insects. Never mind the air pollution.

verzali

10 hours ago

The situation in Bordeaux right now feels close to apocalyptic. I left yesterday. Two hundred thousand people are evacuated, hundreds of homes destroyed, and the fire about 10 miles from the edge of the city.

jaynetics

7 hours ago

I also left yesterday. I thought the mood was still surprisingly calm, considering that there was already enough smoke in the city to make it look like a foggy winter day and smell heavily of campfire.

Now I am wondering if my return flight from Bordeaux in a few days will actually happen. Currently the airport is still operating, although the surrounding area has been evacuated. It really looks apocalyptic there, though:

https://static.actu.fr/uploads/2026/07/aeroport-bordeaux-fum...

TacticalCoder

4 hours ago

Had to evacuate a few years ago: south-west of France. We could see 20 meters high burning flames on the closest hill. But weirdly enough it wasn't the most terrifying: the most terrifying was driving back (to the same place) at night time, in the summer, and feeling like it was snowing... for ashes from a huge fire about 20 kilometers away (?) were raining down the sky and covering everything. I could hardly see the road and didn't understand at first what was happening.

orwin

5 hours ago

It impacted the north of Bordeaux too. from Thursday to saturday, a lot of small fields/forest in Charente/Charente maritime started to catch fire because of the embers. The smoke was also so dense it completly modified the local climate and fucked up the wind prevision (i know because i was suppose to wingfoil all afternoon saturday and we had no wind until like 18-19), also dropping the temperature 2-3C (150km away).

Good luck, and stay safe.

falloon

an hour ago

Pedantic cloud enjoyer here, the article should name this a pyrocumulus not pyrocumulonimbus - the nimbus part means 'rain-bearing' in meteorology, fire clouds don't rain.

julienchastang

39 minutes ago

Incorrect. These fires basically create their own weather systems. All that smoke also contains a lot of water in the material that is burning. (That makes sense. They are trees, after all.) When the smoke reaches high enough in the atmosphere the smoke cools and water can precipitate out (rain) and also lightning potentially producing more fires.

imoverclocked

an hour ago

It rains ash. While it’s a metaphorical use of “rain” it’s physically accurate.

ynac

9 hours ago

Just had the same here in Washington state for the Little Giant fire. Great image in the article. We had another fire cloud behind Rainier the other day, and saw it from the Rount Mainier farm - it really looked like the volcano was smoking up and ready to top-off. <clench>

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/climate-lab/little...

loeg

7 hours ago

"East" of Seattle is certainly one way to describe it (100 miles east).

t-writescode

an hour ago

Would you feel weird with someone saying 100 miles North of Miami, 100 miles Sourth of Orlando, 100 miles west of Huston, 100 miles South of Chicago?

kortilla

41 minutes ago

If they left of the distance yes.

whoamii

2 hours ago

Taylor Swift recently got married east of Seattle

donohoe

3 hours ago

67 comments. One mention of “climate crisis” (appropriate), 3 of “climate credits”.

No one here is really discussing “climate change”.

Is it denial, or just that we’ve accepted the obvious?

derekdahmer

2 hours ago

Climate change is real and contributes to this but there have been massive fires in this region for over a century - primarily from the artificially planted Maritime Pine forests. The 1940s were particularly bad. Look up the Great Fire of 1949.

strken

3 hours ago

What is there to discuss? Outlier weather events are growing more common and the hot summer obviously played a role here.

Even climate change denial has moved from denying the fact to denying that we can fix anything, for either economic or technical reasons.

derrida

2 hours ago

> What is there to discuss?

The governance crisis: how can we follow science on so many things, how can countries completely change on short order, but not for this...

ludston

2 hours ago

Governments have been working on this for more then 20 years now. 40 maybe. As long as I've been alive at least. It's just that all of the actions to try and deal with this have been continuously undermined by fossil fuel industries and right-wing politics.

ColdStream

an hour ago

James Hansons Senate hearing was in 1988, so at least 38 years since it was brought front and center.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_Hearing_of_James_E._Han...

Hansen is still going and has been ringing the alarm that we have deeply under estimated the relative carbon loading and heating potential on emissions. There is a real fear that we have locked in a lot more warming potential than the models have been predicting via several factors. Namely carbon warms slightly more than anticipated, more methane releases, great water vapor levels as a result of the previous two and reduced reflective materials decreasing our relative albedo.

nextaccountic

2 hours ago

We can fix it nonetheless, we have the resources and the need. We broke it and we will fix it

ColdStream

2 hours ago

I think there is some nuance to this. It isn't likely that we will go back to the way it was before industrialization, we are too far past that. But we will head to a new normal that could be manageable.

Problems have solutions, predicaments have responses. We are in a predicament, and the quicker and more direct we can respond the better chance we have to adverting the more nasty paths of the future.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

Yep, the 5 steps of climate denial.

1. It isn't happening.

2. It is happening but we aren't doing it.

3. It is happening and we are doing it but it won't be as bad as we think.

4. It is happening but it is too late to do anything.

5. Acceptance.

The wild card 6th step was 'Jewish Space lasers' or 'Jewish weather control'. It is always the Jewish people who get the rough end of the stick. It was something I wasn't anticipating coming up but here we are, hitting new lows.

Aboutplants

3 hours ago

I truly think it’s because we are in the “Find out” phase and most people have very little hope (justifiably) in anything meaningful actually occurring that can prevent or mitigate climate change even a little bit.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

It is also fairly disheartening to see a lot of proposed responses just quietly get shelved because it was economically not idea on the short term. A lot of them were fairly weak to begin with and even they couldn't hold.

I don't think it will be grim forever, this isn't "DOOOOMED, WE ARE ALL DOOMED!" but I am not holding out for the Frutiger Aero future of only a few decades back.

lazystar

3 hours ago

acceptance; the problems identified. efforts now should focus on innovative solutions that dont rely on nation state investment.

nsainsbury

2 hours ago

The most downvoted comment I've ever made on Hacker News was related to climate change. There's a profoundly ignorant collection of people here who want to stick their head in the sand and pretend everything is fine while the world burns around them.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

Alas, a lot of people are reactive and not proactive. There is also the factor that most people see themselves as the virtuous ones, and they do not appreciate a Cassandra pointing out the awful truths that undermine this narrative.

chewbacha

3 hours ago

Must…

Build…

More…

Datacenters…

But seriously, hacker news routinely denies the obvious when it comes to climate crisis.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

That's because there is the chance that it will benefit them short term over others. F U I got mine! Or just ignorance.

artisinal

3 hours ago

From what I read in another comment this was caused by Napoleon.

throw-the-towel

2 hours ago

Napoleon did his geo-engineering 150 years ago, in a completely different world. He's not the one to blame here.

ColdStream

2 hours ago

Well he didn't help, but this is a good example of why so many military's call climate change a 'Risk Multiplier'.

There was already an issue but it has just been amplified.

j1elo

4 hours ago

Spain is also completely on fire - there's a website that collects all official information and locates every fire on a map:

https://xn--incendiosespaa-2nb.es/ (in Spanish)

It is disheartening to see how everything is basically in red.

kortilla

38 minutes ago

Statements like these embolden climate change deniers because they look so panicked beyond reason. Spain isn’t “completely on fire” and Spain frequently has fires like California.

You need to quantify in sq km or some other objective unit what makes this so unique.

tjwebbnorfolk

4 hours ago

spain loses ~240,000 acres to wildfire every year. this is larger than normal, but fire is normal there

touwer

8 hours ago

Don't look up

cineticdaffodil

7 hours ago

So, if you used climate credits, to build up those forrests. Do they get nil and void, if those forrests burn up?

pibaker

6 hours ago

Bold to assume that buying emission offsets actually leads to anything tangible being done.

bigfatkitten

4 hours ago

Saving the environment with Microsoft Excel.

stinkbeetle

5 hours ago

It fills the pockets of grifters.

juujian

4 hours ago

Nope, read a couple stories about climate credits over the years, and this is a problem. The credits are permanent, even if the new grown forest burns down.

Dylan16807

4 hours ago

If they grow the forest back it's fine for the credits to be permanent. But definitely don't treat it as a reset. Require the regrowth and don't give out new credits for it.

hahahaa

2 hours ago

Needs a coefficient of burn, so instead of 1kg maybe you count it as 200g to allow for burning and and then next replant which allocates to someone else.

c7b

3 hours ago

How would non-permanent credits even work? You purchase the carbon-offset option on a flight, a tree gets planted somewhere, ten years later it burns in a wildfire. Then what?

hahahaa

2 hours ago

I suggest an adjusted value taking burn into account. E.g. you use 20% or whatever of the value. Theory: it ain't 0 if you plant a tree and it is not the whole tree. There has to be a % that represents on average the effectiveness of the plant over 200 years say.

This also addresses the tree death issue.

c7b

40 minutes ago

So 20% of the trees get planted later or maybe never? How is that better?

artisinal

3 hours ago

You claim a new tree on your insurance.

MrVandemar

3 hours ago

Here's the thing you missed: "A tree gets planted".

There's no guarantee that a tree planted to "offset" a flight will grow to any kind of maturity, let alone survive three months. Some saplings just die.

Or maybe that tree got planted in a tree plantation for timber, or wood pulp, and 20 years later, it's framing timber or newsprint.

(I am someone who does revegetation projects and have planted a large number of trees)

c7b

27 minutes ago

If the program works as advertised (big if), the money should flow into projects like yours, with the success rate that those projects generally have. So far ok I'd say. Just pointing out that trying to adjust for fires would tie up capital and create a whole new layer of middlemen. Whatever you think of those programs in the first place, that doesn't sound like an improvement to me.

sunshine-o

6 hours ago

They should go negative because the gigantic amount of CO2 being released right now because of the obvious incompetence of the authorites is criminal.

senderista

3 hours ago

I will be surprised if the climate crisis doesn’t eventually escalate to the point where basically everyone agrees that geoengineering of some kind is worth the risk.

ColdStream

an hour ago

I think the only reason it doesn't come to this is the risk of liability over possible blow backs.

Say they start sulfur injection or whatever, and a year later there are crop failures in India. While it could have happened anyway, there is now a plausible chance that it can be pinned on who ever did the geoengineering. The amount of scapegoating on any climate issue would be wild.

rectang

an hour ago

Geoengineering proposals spring from the same impulse as climate denial — anything to avoid consequences for those contributing to the crisis.

superkuh

9 hours ago

There's a good chance that conflagrations during WWII generated such clouds. There are well established incidents of such in Germany (and Japan) (ref: https://journals.ametsoc.org/view/journals/bams/91/9/2010bam... , Hamburg, Dresden, etc) but nothing for certain in France. The British attacks on Royan which destroyed 85% of it with high explosive and napalam would be the most likely site.

pelasaco

7 hours ago

ceejayoz

an hour ago

> So far this year, there have been 76,720 forest fires in Brazil -- the highest number since 2013, official figures show, with more than half in the Amazon rainforest.

https://incendieencours.fr/en/incendies says 17 ongoing and 92 recent in France. I can't promise they count the same way, but… the motive's also substantially different:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvgxv8n7wd0o

> Most fires here are illegally started by humans, according to scientists, the Federal Police, and the government: loggers and miners looking to exploit land in the Amazon, or farmers turning it into pasture.

throw-the-towel

2 hours ago

Wow, the audacity of that guy. When is the rest of the world sanctioning France for these fires?

marcosdumay

7 hours ago

Unsurprisingly, that was just propaganda from some rich locals protecting their market power. What was really surprising was the number of people around here asking some army to come murder Brazilians.

But then, it's real that Bolsonaro was criminally negligent on fire-avoidance. What we will discover next year is how much of it could be avoided at all.

moralestapia

3 hours ago

>it is a war-like scenario where we are under constant bombardment and must get everyone to safety

Thank you for your service everyone, these are real life heroes like the ones you see on Star Wars movies but real.

ButlerianJihad

4 hours ago

Google Maps provides overlays for wildfires and air quality. I can watch Western Europe from here.

ares623

4 hours ago

One of the biggest lies is that these events will only happen (or will happen first) to the "global south" and only affect the "other peoples".

Unfortunately for us, the Earth has no preferences and doesn't run on our schedule.

nolok

4 hours ago

I don't know where you live or where you heard that but it is not a lie that was told in france at least. If you want a "lie", it was how far in the future that was going to happen, but that's mostly because the deniers got control of the messaging for a long time.

yongjik

3 hours ago

I know it's a cold and cynical take, but if it has to happen somewhere, better for it to happen in Europe, the US, or other developed countries. These countries can at least do something to keep climate crisis from getting worse. (Or... more realistically, to keep it from getting worse too fast.)

AnimalMuppet

2 hours ago

Too keep it from killing too many people too fast, anyway.

tjwebbnorfolk

4 hours ago

on average, 240k acres burn every year in Spain. this is somewhat larger, but not abnormal. it's just near people this time.

chewbacha

4 hours ago

I’m sure if we build a few more AI data centers the world will cool down and we’ll stop having all these fires.

Just a few more GPUs ought to fix it.

ColdStream

an hour ago

I always though it would be funny if we actually did manage to get to super AGI, we then ask it "How can we save the future for us?"

It thinks for a few days, cross comparing everything in written history and then comes back with only a single sentence.

"Love the Earth and life like you love yourselves."

Then it goes quiet not answering anything else.