I know right. Where’s the «Elite»?

Because it was the CEOs idea?

They were just leaving room for the "Ultimate" model, to be released next year.

Dell did this too with their workstation laptops, Dell Pro Max 16 Plus. :/

We're running out of space on our e-commerce UI elements and physical labels to fit some of these names.

Schemes like this just indicate they've joined the USB IF.

Why would they? It's a very scalable naming scheme, there's even room for Max Plus Pro Ultra, with 256GB of RAM.

More numbers and letters and phrases = more excite! much customer!

Agreed, what the heck were they thinking, it's obvious it should've been Ryzen AI Max Plus Pro Ultra 495.

It’s like after 10 years of DLCs where every items has 5 suffixes and prefixes

AI means it has npu, Max+ is marking the memory channel, PRO is a normal label for chips that have extra security baked in, it has been this way since forever.

I don't see anything wrong with the name.

On RAM supplies, the best estimates I've seen are https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/dram/cxmt-close-t...

They are estimating a 25% shortfall in supply remaining in 2030, even with Chinese companies ramping up DDR5 supply.

It's not looking great - the RAM producers need more of the same machines that other semi-conductor manufactures need and the suppliers of those seem unable to increase production.

Yes, others should be able to do this too, and the change is larger memory chips.

The next big step is Medusa Halo, which will have a 384-bit LPDDR6 interface. Those should be able to support 256GB at release, with 512GB coming later with larger chips (But I don't know to what extent people should trust the memory vendor roadmaps.) I'm not sure if they will be out in a year. Probably will be in a year and half.

Unfortunately we don't have any indication of memory pricing coming down in the next year, and many indications pointing to memory pricing continuing to increase pretty substantially over the next six months, especially for the LPDDR5X we use in Framework Desktop.

The market research I have seen indicated DRAM prices will not come back to “normal” until 2030 at least and probably 2031. You can wait, but it will probably be longer than a year

Are you generally happy with it? What do you mainly use it for?

I'm kinda tempted by the frameworks because they are somewhat energy efficient and compact (which I both value highly!) but my concern is that the GPU is on the low end for 1440p gaming (while being barely price-competitive with a self-built Ryzen9950 + 9070XT combination).

Likewise here, my setup costs 2k+ more eur as well. Given that memory bandwidth remains the same I don't think it's worth buying if you have the 1st gen framework desktop. Usecase caveats apply.

what I read in I think the direct AMD press, it's essentially like a 10% upgrade to compute but mostly ram.

I agree, this is the direction AMD was going in to larger attached memory and they got hit by the memory cartel pricing; They likely were going to hit 256GB instead of this weird glitch in the sizing.

So, yes, of course they're going to hit higher memory sizes; but since they models are meant for laptops and to get the speed you want for inference, they're soldered, you have no real options.

Framework in particular might have a high value on ebay as I assume this will be a drop in replacement for their existing motherboard.

I shared this internally, and the team confirmed this is indeed a bug in our email form rendering. We've added it to the development backlog.

You shouldn't need to tab first, right? Enter on an input field should submit the form unless they go out of their way to break it?

I run Qwen3-Coder-Next-UD-Q4_K_XL and other than the initial wait to initialise context (which takes less than 2 minutes) subsequent prompts return in less than a minute, usually less than 30s.

If your performance is significantly slower then you are probably doing it in CPU - there was some fiddling required to get it to use GPU (I use llama.cpp)

Try poolside that came out yesterday https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49004937

or Qwen 3.5 122B A10B, both use more memory and still have experts sized for decent speed at the 395’s memory bandwidth at 4bit quantization

If you are waiting 40 minutes for a prompt on a Ryzen max+ you have no idea what you are doing.

For those wondering, the AI Max 395 has around 256GB/s of memory bandwidth, whereas this new 495 has 273GB/s. So a very modest improvement in bandwidth.

I use exactly the setup you describe; it can handle 1-3 agents working if the agent work has IO delays. with MTP models, prefill is quite fast.

Not sure what damage you have, but no one waits 40 minutes per prompt or even a minute; The A3B model loads within 10 seconds and a simple response in opencode is maybe at most a minute, then catches up in 3-5second bursts depending on IO.

I put dynamic context pruning into opencode and tweaked it for 45k-85k context before it shrinks; this lets me get into 500k token sizes and fixed on medium sized github repos.

There's a chance this comment is a skill error:

1. USe llamacpp with a MTP model

2. Use reasoning-budget and reasoning-message

3. Tailor your agent to use the reasoning-message to use subagents and dyanmic compaction.

---

Now you have a reasonable coding agent for cloning, building and extending any github project I've seen so far.

I have an NVIDIA Spark thingy (the ASUS one) and it's the same problem there, though the prefill side is superior to the Ryzen ones.

But I actually think 128GB is too little. There are some compelling models that are above what can fit in that at reasonable quants (e.g. DeepSeek V4 Flash) but could if the system was 256GB.

If RAM prices weren't so f*cked I think we'd be seeing 256GB and even 512GB unified memory systems becoming quite common. As it is I think it will be 10 years before >128GB becomes feasible on a regular consumer machine for normal people again.

Based on the product spec sheet[1] it appears that the Framework Desktop motherboard is mini-ITX, and that the chassis is[2] as well.

It’s fully possible that I’ve missed something, but it doesn’t appear to be proprietary to me.

[1]: https://frame.work/desktop?tab=specs

[2]: https://frame.work/products/desktop-case

IIRC, Framework did ask AMD to explore a more repairable approach with socketable CPU and RAM for these chips and they did but came back and said it wouldn't perform well enough that way.

What’s stopping you from building that yourself instead of having to go through Framework?

What do you mean?

The whole point is that these APUs present a pretty unique value proposition (lowish performance GPUs with massive amounts of RAM attached), and framework is afaik the only vendor shipping them on standard mini-ITX boards

There is no socketable Unified Memory platform. The entire point of this SoC is that it has Unified Memory. The Framework Desktop has a Mini-ITX board, but you MUST use a solderable SoC with HBM stacked memory to get a Unified Memory outcome. For local AI workloads, that's the only part that matters, which is the entire point of wanting 192GB of RAM available on an APU.

I like the repairability and modularity of my Framework 13 laptop, and I still bought a maxed out MBP M5 Max because for local LLM, unified memory is all that matters.

Framework is going for a computer OEM market where they need to make margin, hence the soldered-on components and relatively limited options. People in the pre-built computer market overwhelmingly don't care about replaceable components, because anyone else will just buy components and build a PC, for both the greater market of options AND overall lower price than buying pre-built (if they don't overspec).

We can't share pricing yet, but certainly will before we open orders. The 128GB has been selling well, and we just re-opened orders with stock landing within two weeks.

It's competition is M5 Ultra, not cheap.

If you have to ask you don’t want to know

It’s a fantastic dev box i got the framework desktop and its awesome as a developer desktop

> A reasonable use case is to have multiple smaller models loaded- you can have an image generation model loaded along with the text model.

Lemonade server updated yesterday for an Arena model / ai routing.

---

The Lemonade local AI server allows easily deploying LLM workloads across Ryzen AI NPUs, Radeon GPUs, and CPUs with ease under both Windows and Linux. The most significant change with Lemonade 11.5 is the completion of the Lemonade Router that can be used for automatically routing queries to relevant models based on defined policies -- or even LLM-as-a-router for using a small LLM to in turn determine which model to route a particular request.

The Lemonade Router allows steering requests based on rule, classifier, semantic similarity, or LLM-as-router policies. The policies are defined in JSON files or can also be authored via the Lemonade GUI. More details on these router capabilities can be found via this commit.

Lemonade 11.5 also introduces a server-side job engine to let clients post multi-step recipes and managing them via /jobs endpoints. From these endpoints the muilti-step recipes can be paused / interrupted / resumed / deleted. And another one is that the lemond daemon can now act as an MCP client host to connect external stdio MCP servers.

https://www.phoronix.com/news/AMD-Lemonade-11.5

https://lemonade-server.ai/

We're fans of Cory Doctorow, and he is a Framework Laptop user!

That’s a common expression.

Who blatantly ripped that off from Karl Marx...

the thing about ECC memory is that it doesn't support reporting of ECC errors, so it ends up just hiding the fact that your RAM has started to go bad. this is good if you replace RAM every n years, but not if you intend to use the RAM until it starts degrading.

Hear me out...

What would you say is the likelihood of an LLM hallucination vs. a correctable RAM error?

It wasn't our preferred way of making an announcement, but all that we are currently able to do this early on this pre-release processor.