Ornith-1.0: self-improving open-source models for agentic coding

112 pointsposted 5 hours ago
by danboarder

28 Comments

CharlesW

4 hours ago

Previously: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48709744

https://swelljoe.com/post/will-it-mythos/: "Poor performer here, only found the one bug that almost every model found, despite its performance on other benchmarks being excellent for its size. […] It also performs poorly in a chat without tools, exhibiting an ehthusiasm for hallucination. I’m currently working on a replication of this with full tool access, including bash/Python, which may allow this model to be competitive."

NitpickLawyer

2 hours ago

> It also performs poorly in a chat without tools, exhibiting an ehthusiasm for hallucination. I’m currently working on a replication of this with full tool access, including bash/Python, which may allow this model to be competitive.

How is that a serious phrase in '26? I mean I have no idea if this fine-tune is good, haven't tried it, but testing a (clearly) agentic model without tool access and expecting it to work is crazy, no? What was he even testing?!

nodja

an hour ago

Last thing you want a model to do is hallucinate a tool call and it's outputs...

reactordev

an hour ago

Visual Inspection Before Execution… it’s all vibe…

vikingcat

2 hours ago

Maybe expecting it to recognize it's limitation without tools instead of hallucinate. But yeah, not wholly useful. It's performance (and proclivity to hallucinations) with tools is what really matters.

ricardobayes

2 hours ago

This is the first Qwen fine-tune that is not immediately rejected by the local LLM community, and in some cases even being recommended. Based on my limited usage, it is good, gives creative solutions to coding problems. I don't expect 9-35B models to one-click create full apps. Most people who were complaining did so .

v3ss0n

an hour ago

Its not any better. Most of us at LocalLLama community dont like it except a few new people poping out and making posts.

gslepak

34 minutes ago

Indeed, it performed worse than Qwen3.6-27b in my basic test.

It gave a fancier looking answer, but did a worse job following the prompt.

dofm

29 minutes ago

Roughly my experience so far; it trips up on itself a bit.

However, it's much more inclined to do web search unprompted, which is fascinating in its own way.

NitpickLawyer

22 minutes ago

> LocalLLama community

Ah, the place that shit on gpt-oss because it wasn't good at porn. That place is not what it used to be, hasn't been since that karpathy tweet, tbh. It's mostly slop and vibes nowadays.

v3ss0n

4 minutes ago

and a lot of bots advertising a rename models like this one.

monkmartinez

2 hours ago

> Most people who were complaining did so .

It has been this way since the beginning, unfortunately. There is certainly no harm in trying on local models on local workloads with modest guardrails.

Like most of these models (Qwen, Gemma, Llama, gpt-oss), finding all the little gotchas like, special tokens and prompt structure, model preference are a PITA right now. The reward are really nice models that run exceptionally well in agentic harnesses tuned with the prompts and parameters you fought so hard to learn.

arcanemachiner

an hour ago

We must be in different communities... Qwen models are the most recommended ones that will actually run on local hardware that is accessible to the masses!

montroser

an hour ago

Yeah, but they're talking about fine-tunes.

kennywinker

4 hours ago

Can anyone explain what’s the story here? Is this just a re-skinned qwen? Who is deepreinforce-ai and why isn’t this model listed on their website?

How does it self-improve, does the model change on disk - or just during a single context run it gets better?

simonw

4 hours ago

It doesn't self-improve, that's a misleading headline.

As far as I can tell they trained it by running their own reinforcement learning on top of Qwen and Gemma 4 (not sure how they combined weights from both, or if they used Qwen as the basis and Gemma 4 to help train?) - so the "self-improving" is about their training process, not how you use the weights.

sisve

an hour ago

Do you think we will get a self-improving model in 26 or 27? Maybe not a native one but some kind of hack so a model will learn something without loosing part of the context window?

kamranjon

3 hours ago

I think the 9b and 31b dense are Gemma models and the 35B-MoE, and 397B-MoE are Qwen models since these are model sizes covered by each of them respectively

kennywinker

4 hours ago

Gotcha. That makes more sense. We ran the model to train the model -> “self-improving”.

v3ss0n

an hour ago

Clickbait title.

S0y

2 hours ago

These are simply benchmaxxed versions of either Qwen or Gemma 4.

2001zhaozhao

an hour ago

If so, it's impressive they managed to benchmaxx Qwen even further than it's already benchmaxxed.

v3ss0n

an hour ago

Nah , they just put graphs with different color prioritizing themselves.

jorisw

2 hours ago

Citation needed

S0y

23 minutes ago

Sure. https://deep-reinforce.com/ornith_1_0.html

>Built on top of pretrained Gemma 4 and Qwen 3.5, it achieves state-of-the-art performance among open-source models of comparable size on coding benchmarks.

>Ornith-1.0 is a self-improving training framework. Instead of relying on human-designed harnesses to drive solution generation in RL, Ornith-1.0 learns to generate both solution rollouts and the task-specific harnesses that guide those rollouts.

v3ss0n

an hour ago

Self-Improving bullshit. It is just Qwen 3.5 finetune benchmaxxed . Nothing spectacular . even fails at benchmarks. Long session tool calls sucks and hallucinate a lot with that too. Just use Qwen 3.6 and 3.5 122b.

anana_

2 hours ago

They keep mentioning a 31B dense model, but there are no benchmarks or weights for it anywhere?