Oracle shed about 20k roles globally in the last year

68 pointsposted 2 hours ago
by Lyngbakr
(bbc.com)

68 Comments

cryo32

36 minutes ago

None of this is due to AI. That’s just the cover story that stops the stock crashing. The reality is the market is contracting and it’s doing that because the extraction and monthly financial models are hurting other businesses which are also contracting because of lower customer demand.

catigula

21 minutes ago

Source

>I made it up. It was invented by a writer.

shrubble

2 minutes ago

A friend met with Oracle salesdroids (his company has spent a few million with them in the last few years).

They told him everything is oriented towards AI, to the point that otherwise profitable software is not being updated and development has stopped on anything new.

Oracle has a lot of niche solutions and the one my friend’s corporation uses is profitable but not on the AI path, so it is being put into maintenance mode.

jabedude

an hour ago

For those curious, this is a report about firings from the last year. Not a new round of layoffs:

> Oracle shed about 21,000 roles globally in the last year as the US technology giant reshapes its business around artificial intelligence (AI), the firm's latest annual report shows.

GL26

an hour ago

Now is precisely not the time to cut jobs, but to invest in people's usage of AI. You have domain expertise, and you are going to burn tokens trying to replace people's jobs, but the AI revolution is not at all about people replacement, its about a change of paradigm. Watch them closely rehire thousands of new employees (who won't have the domain expertise) once they see that you actually need people to operate their company :)

servo_sausage

an hour ago

Depends on which jobs; at a big enough scale you have people who are so deep in the hierarchy that their real connection to the domain is low.

Seems possible to flatten out a company, in a way the domain knowledge is kept.

That being said, I haven't seen many layoffs that actually seem directly AI related, because the main effects are not hiring junior Devs, and not outsourcing to low cost/skill areas.

breckenedge

an hour ago

Oracle overcommitted on behalf of OpenAI, taking on debt to meet their obligations. Not that healthy companies are not also doing ridiculous layoffs, but in this case, Oracle does have to do some drastic things to get out of this tailspin.

DanielHB

42 minutes ago

What I don't get is why these companies are in all the rush to replace people with AI tools. Stuff is changing so fast that capital investment right now will just need to be reworked on after a few years when things settle down a little.

And that is not even considering how much it costs to run AI right now at scale AND retraining people to use the new tools AND possible disruption in existing workflows.

If I was running a large org I would actively try to slow down AI adoption in most areas until there are clear established solutions.

coldpie

19 minutes ago

It's because these are public companies. Public companies are not in the business of developing good products and selling them to customers and having a sustainable long-term vision, they are in the business of selling their stock. Right now, thanks to a very effective marketing campaign driven by people who are invested in AI companies, the stock market wants to see stories about employees being replaced with AI, so that's what these companies are selling.

ransom1538

an hour ago

I easily do more than x 5 the workload I did in 2020. Replacing an employee with domain knowledge (only thing valuable now), with someone with zero domain knowledge is corporate suicide in 2026.

However, if you are oracle sending out consultants with zero domain knowledge around to help.... I would rather just use claude.

xpct

17 minutes ago

What type of work are we talking about here?

lordluca

2 hours ago

Tech CEOs suddenly love blaming AI for mass job cuts

eagerpace

an hour ago

You can’t read the headlines, they’re marketing like anything else. Companies are free to spin them however they want and journalists are happy to write them however they will scare you the most. Those are the only truths.

bluGill

an hour ago

It is the latest fad. They blamed other fads for job cuts in the past.

angoragoats

2 hours ago

IMO it’s not sudden, the AI excuses have been gradual and ramping up for a couple years now.

VladVladikoff

an hour ago

Maybe because the models keep getting better and the tools are slowly getting good enough to replace people? Keep in mind we’re talking about oracle here, it’s not like we’re talking about humanity’s best and brightest.

reliabilityguy

an hour ago

> Maybe because the models keep getting better and the tools are slowly getting good enough to replace people?

I am not sure we are there yet.

In my experience even the SoTA models are faaaaar away from replacing humans, maybe making them a bit faster.

repelsteeltje

an hour ago

The correlation between job cuts and ai growth is real. But it's related more to ai cost than ai performance. Especially in Oracle's highly leveraged case.

mschuster91

an hour ago

> I am not sure we are there yet.

When talking about bullshit jobs like, say, taking a bill received by paper and manually extracting data from it (company name, invoice number, bank account details) to enter into an accounting program, AI is already good enough according to the pareto principle.

cm2187

42 minutes ago

Say what you want about their business practices, their products are top notch.

dofm

an hour ago

I doubt we are there yet, no.

But we are talking about a corporation that is one of the most sociopathic in modern business history.

jchw

2 hours ago

Yeah, the actual funny thing is they've been blaming AI since almost GPT-3 era.

thinkingtoilet

an hour ago

I think a lot of them have drank the kool-aid. They go to conferences and then some talking head from one of the AI companies gets on stage and tells them things like they don't need developers and how AI is already good enough to revolutionize the world. They buy it hook, line, and sinker and then do stuff like this.

ramon156

an hour ago

What's even weirder is the Founder of canonical has a #hiring badge on their LinkedIn profile. What kind of message is that?

desultory

an hour ago

Fire and re-hire from a desperate pool of anxious workers who will accept any offer to escape unemployment.

Tade0

an hour ago

Well, not "any". -15% seems to be the magic number looking at my network and has been like that for 2 years now.

They're going to flip us all like burger patties eventually - we're done on this side.

mrtksn

an hour ago

What's stopping anyone else from using AI and eat into Oracle's market? Maybe know how specific for the market but at least 20K people with know how on this business are available at this moment.

I'm inclined to believe that its no longer the case of employees being replaced by AI but simply those businesses being replaced by AI and the current businesses who were able to benefit from AI are reaping the momentum they have but eventually this will end.

WoodenChair

43 minutes ago

> What's stopping anyone else from using AI and eat into Oracle's market?

Open source databases have already been doing this for decades. You can’t just clone its products and expect to eliminate it. Oracle is driven by a strong sales culture and ruthless business strategy.

mrtksn

39 minutes ago

And why AI can't do all that? Apparently it can be a doctor, engineer, musician etc. but when it comes to do the jobs of certain class of people suddenly can't do that. It doesn't add up, maybe sales isn't as impossible to learn and do?

samiv

4 minutes ago

It doesn't play golf at the club with the C level.

2000UltraDeluxe

9 minutes ago

Claude has neither golf buddies nor a business network.

cm2187

an hour ago

A bit premature I think. Right now it is employees making room for AI investments

conartist6

2 hours ago

It's a move I would only wish on my worst enemy. Good riddance to them

Roark66

43 minutes ago

They will be hiring frantically next year.

These companies seem to be led by mind bogglingly short sighted people. Maybe they should be replaced by AI. It can't possibly get any worse than now, right?

red75prime

36 minutes ago

An adjacent comment: "For those curious, this is a report about firings from the last year. Not a new round of layoffs."

usrnm

2 hours ago

Out of 141000, about 15%

Oras

an hour ago

still a large percentage.

mrhottakes

an hour ago

Yes, that is a large percentage.

lenerdenator

14 minutes ago

I'm trying to remember which Marvel capeslop movie it was where the kid gets a bunch of Oracle professional-grade computer hardware or something as a gift. Larry makes a cameo, of course. Maybe it was Iron Man 2?

Like, mate, if you want to be a superhero in real life, stop laying off thousands of people and working the remaining people ragged. That's all you gotta do.

Lucasoato

an hour ago

Have they layoff their lawyers or engineers?

strongpigeon

an hour ago

What’s crazy is how Oracle’s free cash flows have gone from “money-printing machine” to deep in the red due to their data center investments. My guess is that some of those cuts are to try to balance that?

DanielHB

17 minutes ago

Well you have to somehow both indicate that you are not behind in the AI race but also that you are not hemorrhaging money. That means crapping all over your org in order to fund the data center spending.

All in the all-mighty fiduciary duty to your investors of course.

andrewshadura

an hour ago

Shed roles? They fired people, not "shed roles".

cucumber3732842

an hour ago

If they're not hiring to fill the roll after firing it's kind of both.

EnglishRobin96

43 minutes ago

Oh they're definitely hiring after firing.

xbmcuser

2 hours ago

where its sits with the AI bubble I think Oracle is the 1 of the major companies apart from the OpenAI that would go belly up once the AI bubble crashes.

tw04

an hour ago

Larry has embedded the company way too deeply into the intelligence and military apparatus to ever go belly up. He’d be first in line for a government handout.

nosioptar

2 hours ago

Nothing would make me happier than to piss on Oracle's grave.

this_user

an hour ago

Oracle has a huge, entrenched enterprise business that will keep them alive almost indefinitely, just as Microsoft does.

hunterjrj

an hour ago

I think you underestimate just how entrenched Oracle’s database offering is in the enterprise.

DanielHB

12 minutes ago

I did a project for a big telecom in Brazil where they kept everything in one massive Oracle database that ran out of 2 oracle refrigerators[1]. They kept freaking logs on the database, like normal application level logs.

DBA would go around screaming if you were logging too much stuff. I assumed they had some sort of periodic cleanup because I couldn't see that stuff being practical long term.

Technically it was 2 databases, one was a read replica for longer running data analysis of course.

That telecom has at least 100 million paying customers (maybe much more). I don't see they ever moving away from Oracle, they are more likely to go bankrupt than ever leaving.

[1]: Oracle RAC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle_RAC

marcyb5st

an hour ago

True, but they also took huge debts to build AI DCs and not sure if the DB part of the company can cushion such a fall. According to [1] their IaaS line of business brings 4.8B USD/quarter (so say 20B/year), but they have ~120B of debt (outstanding + new debt they are trying to find people to pay for).

They are justifying that on commitments (500+B USD), but 300B of those are tied to OpenAI. So, if OpenAI goes belly up or at least doesn't follow their crazy growth projections, they would have to find the same amount of consumption quickly to repay the interest on said debt and eventually the principal.

It is a lot of money for a company the size of Oracle (~500B market cap).

[1] https://finance.yahoo.com/markets/stocks/articles/oracle-500...

dofm

an hour ago

That is the one bit of Oracle that can't really be further subdivided. The rest of Oracle could be diced and sliced.

AznHisoka

2 hours ago

Why? They’re way too big to fail. Tons of corporations rely too much on them

dofm

an hour ago

They are not. Maybe they will be treated as such if the bubble bursts while while Trump is in power, because of loyalties.

But Oracle could relatively easily be broken up and sold off. Essentially all of the global consulting business units could sell to competitors in the various niches, the hardware business and the cloud hosting business could be separated, etc.

Plenty of companies worldwide would be up for buying pieces of Oracle at a bargain price.

"Too big to fail" only really applies in extreme circumstances (which might happen, admittedly) and with essentially monolithic businesses (or banking).

I don't think even Microsoft is too big to fail.

And I don't think people should casually entertain the idea that really any tech industry company is too big to fail, because tech corporations that cannot die point the way to a Rollerball future.

skerit

an hour ago

Which AI bubble? The stock bubble one or the imagined "one day all the LLMs are going to disappear from the face of the Earth" one?

uberex

an hour ago

The money side is a bubble. The LLM cat is out of the bag.

dude250711

an hour ago

The classic autocomplete survived previous bubbles.

So the predictive autocomplete will survive those too.

psychoslave

an hour ago

Dot-com bubble crashing didn’t mean the web disappeared.

soundwave106

15 minutes ago

Some of the shakier dot com companies did, though.

And the dot com bubble collapse of Nortel and Worldcom shows that even well-established companies with significant non-bubble investments are vulnerable if the companies make poor economic decisions (in both of those cases, the collapse was driven by excessively aggressive acquisitions).

Likewise, LLM's won't disappear completely with a stock market crash. But the weaker players might.

benatkin

an hour ago

I think perhaps they'll crash more than others because they aren't AI enough. It's more of an AI financing bubble than an AI bubble.

sl-1

an hour ago

Don't threaten me with good time!