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39 pointsposted 2 hours ago
by mltvc

39 Comments

stephenlf

43 minutes ago

> The cost of turning written business logic into code has dropped to zero

Didn’t realize this was science fiction.

AstroBen

8 minutes ago

I swear all of these are coming from the prompt "hey chatgpt rewrite this article that got a lot of views"

I've seen non-technical people vibe code with agents. They're capable of producing janky, very basic CRUD apps. Code cost definitely ain't zero

geetee

40 minutes ago

I appreciate the author making that the first sentence.

heliumtera

10 minutes ago

But it is true, the cost is effectively zero. There will be, for a long time, free models available and any one of them will give you code back, always!

They never refuse. Worst case scenario the good models ask for clarification.

The cost for producing code is zero and code producers are in a really bad spot.

bopbopbop7

a minute ago

Because who cares about correct and compilable code! Any code will do!

autoexec

6 minutes ago

> The cost for producing code is zero

Zero as long as your time is worth nothing, and bad code and security issues cost you nothing maybe.

"Getting code" has always been dead simple and cheap. Getting actually good code that works and doesn't turn into a problem for you down the road is the expensive part

chasd00

5 minutes ago

> Zero as long as your time is worth nothing

i can't remember who said it but a long time ago i remember reading "Linux is free if your time is worthless". Now we all use Linux one way or the other.

dt3ft

4 minutes ago

I beg to differ. Let's say you're right. Code producers should turn to agriculture and let their managers and product owners prompt AI to produce code. How about code maintainers? Ever heard the mantra "You build it, you run it"? Lets say that AI can build it. Can it run it though? All alone, safely, securely and reliably? No. It can't. We can keep dreaming though, and when will AI code production services turn profitable? Is there a single one which turned profitable?

mohsen1

41 minutes ago

I am thinking about this a lot right now. Pretty existential stuff.

I think builders are gonna be fine. The type of programmer were people would put up with just because they could really go in their cave for a few days and come out with a bug fix that nobody else on the team could figure out is going to have a hard time.

Interestingly AI coding is really good at that sort of thing and less good at fully grasping user requirements or big picture systems. Basically things that we had to sit in meetings a lot for.

ericpauley

19 minutes ago

This has been my experience too. That insane race condition inside the language runtime that is completely inscrutable? Claude one-shots it. Ask it to work on that same logic to add features and it will happily introduce race conditions that are obvious to an engineer but a local test will never uncover.

wiseowise

6 minutes ago

> The type of programmer were people would put up with just because they could really go in their cave for a few days and come out with a bug fix that nobody else on the team could figure out is going to have a hard time.

Amen. It was a good time while it lasted.

falloutx

3 minutes ago

meetings hardly reach anywhere. most of the details are eventually figure out by developers when interacting with the code. If all ideas from PMs are every implemented in a software, it would eventually turn into bloatware before even reaching MVP stage.

oytis

11 minutes ago

All software engineers become pretty much the same in this world though. Anyone can sit in the meetings.

ossa-ma

an hour ago

With all due respect to the author, this is a lot of words for not much substance. Rehashing the same thoughts everyone already thinks but not being bold enough to make a concrete prediction.

This is the time for bold predictions, you’ve just told us we’re in a crucible moment yet you end the article passively….

YZF

7 minutes ago

Predictions

- Small companies using AI are going to kick the sh*t out of large companies that are slow to adapt.

- LLMs will penetrate more areas of our lives. Closer to the STTNG computer. They will be agents in the real life sense and possibly in the physical world as well (robots).

- ASICs will eat nVidia's lunch.

- We will see an explosion of software and we will also see more jobs for people who are able to maintain all this software (using AI tools). There is going to be a lot more custom software for very specific purposes.

falloutx

a minute ago

> Small companies using AI are going to kick the sh*t out of large companies that are slow to adapt.

Big companies are sales machines and their products have been terrible for ages. Microsoft enjoys the top spot in software sales only due to their sales staff pushing impossible deals every year.

jdjdndbdhsjsb

43 minutes ago

Here is my bold prediction: 2026 is the year where companies start the lay offs.

2026 is the year where we all realise that we can be our own company and build the stuff in our dreams rather than the mundane crap we do at work.

Honestly I am optimistic about computing in general. Llms will open things up for novices and experts alike. We can move into I the fields where we can use our brain power... But all we need is enough memory and compute to control our destiny....

falloutx

a few seconds ago

Except it started in 2023, we are in the middle of layoff waves.

Muromec

21 minutes ago

>Here is my bold prediction: 2026 is the year where companies start the lay offs.

Start? Excuse moi

AIorNot

24 minutes ago

I don't know, its a bit of a hellscape in tech right now as thousands of people with deep domain knowledge and people knowledge and business knowledge (ie experienced engineers managers and product owners), were laid off by C Suites desperate to keep the AI funded mandates going

Do you know how hard it to make a successful company or even make money? Its like saying any actor can goto hollywood and be a star

VCs wont fund everyone

Nobody is sure of anything

falloutx

6 minutes ago

> The cost of turning written business logic into code has dropped to zero. Or, at best, near-zero.

Zero if you dont consider Anthropic's API pricing, the prompter's hourly rate and verification bottleneck.

heliumtera

a few seconds ago

Everybody offers a generous free tier.

Verification? LoL, lmao even. Your vibes are low.

If you're a professional code producer, you shit out code as fast as possible. Don't give anyone time to analyze the disgusting pile of shit you generated, just shit out code as fast as you can and can it a win! Who would prove you wrong?

Would someone waste their biological precious resources reviewing machine generated slop, when your cadence is super human? Would someone use the same machine you used to evaluate itself? Lol

aleda145

9 minutes ago

I personally love this development. Sure, I find some pleasure in writing code. But what I love most is mapping out a gnarly problem on pen and paper. Then the code is "just" an implementation detail. Guess I'm an ideas guy as per the author?

Xiol

29 minutes ago

> The cost of turning written business logic into code has dropped to zero

Tokens are free now?

heliumtera

6 minutes ago

Yes. Every platform offers free tokens generously.

That is a true statement. Might not be much, but is enough for you to produce some code and shit out a readme and then show on hacker news that your capable of pushing to git with the help of llms

TheCoreh

26 minutes ago

> Or, at best, near-zero.

blamarvt

14 minutes ago

I mean, lots of numbers are near zero depending on your definition of near.

jongjong

4 minutes ago

I predict it's going to be a bloodbath. People who worked for Big Tech have no idea what's coming. Some of us software engineers who have been outside have been experiencing issues for almost a decade. The industry is extremely anti-competitive.

Whatever you produce, nobody is going to use unless you produce it under the banner of Big Tech. There are no real opportunities for real founders.

This feeling of doom that software engineers started to feel after LLMs is how I was feeling 5 years earlier. People are confused because they think the problem is that AI is automating them but reality is that our problems arise from a deeper systemic issue at the core of our economic system. AI is just a convenient cover story, it's not the reason why we are doomed. Once people accept that we can start to work towards a political solution like UBI or better...

PostOnce

23 minutes ago

I personally believe (and so far, my evidence suggests) that AI doesn't anywhere near as well as claimed for almost any of its use cases.

However, let's suppose the alternate case:

If AI works as claimed, people in their tens of millions will be out of work.

New jobs won't be created quickly enough to keep them occupied (and fed).

Billionaires own the media and the social media and will use it to attempt to prevent change (i.e. apocalyptic taxation)

What, then, will those people do? Well, they say "the devil makes work for idle hands", and I'm curious what that's going to look like.

monero-xmr

30 minutes ago

I own (cofounded) a medium-sized saas business with hundreds of employees. I maintain final decision of everything technical and still code every day because it’s important. All of the engineers use LLM tools, you’d be stupid not to. But I need good engineers, I replace good engineers when someone leaves, and the business itself is so much larger than just programming. The system is just so huge and complex, and I am the benevolent dictator that architected it and maintains the core design decisions, that the LLM does not replace the need for engineers nor my own expertise.

Furthermore if we were truly in the utopia the author describes, why do all the LLM companies employ (and pay top dollar) for so many engineers? Why does OpenAI pay for slack when they could just vibe code a chat app in an hour?

The challenge of building a real, valuable software business (or any business) is so much harder than using LLM to prompt “build me a successful software business”

kgraves

9 minutes ago

When these vibe coded projects realise that maintenance, security updates, API changes are still needed. Get ready for a massive swing back to senior software developers being in demand.

Playing software maintainer while many vibe coded web apps aren't built with proper software architecture or practices only makes the swing back to senior engineers being in demand a possibility.

Good luck to those who are building 600K-LOC vibe coded web apps with 40+ APIs stitched together.

IhateAI_2

42 minutes ago

I feel like YC has a bunch of these optimistic blog posts ready to throw up on the front page anytime something goes viral about how LLMs are bad.

Software isnt going to become more economically valuable its going to be used to replace economic inputs of labor with units of compute.

Its entirely intended to take humans out of the equation or devalue human labor and it always has. Dont be a fool.

kykat

31 minutes ago

To me it seems like the big question for the future will be how to achieve political relevance as "the little guy". It seems like with LLMs the typical "get educated" pathway for the lower class is closing quick. I dread to think of a world where large portions of society are essentially "useless".

pousada

33 minutes ago

What went viral? To me it just seems like people are pretty divided on the topic which makes sense as it’s an emerging technology. I feel I see as many posts against AI as glazing it.

tptacek

24 minutes ago

That's literally what automation is. You could make the same argument against the power loom. People did!

IhateAI_3

19 minutes ago

*THE word ''Luddite'' continues to be applied with contempt to anyone with doubts about technology, especially the nuclear kind. Luddites today are no longer faced with human factory owners and vulnerable machines. As well-known President and unintentional Luddite D. D. Eisenhower prophesied when he left office, there is now a permanent power establishment of admirals, generals and corporate CEO's, up against whom us average poor bastards are completely outclassed, although Ike didn't put it quite that way. We are all supposed to keep tranquil and allow it to go on, even though, because of the data revolution, it becomes every day less possible to fool any of the people any of the time. If our world survives, the next great challenge to watch out for will come - you heard it here first - when the curves of research and development in artificial intelligence, molecular biology and robotics all converge. Oboy. It will be amazing and unpredictable, and even the biggest of brass, let us devoutly hope, are going to be caught flat-footed. It is certainly something for all good Luddites to look forward to if, God willing, we should live so long. Meantime, as Americans, we can take comfort, however minimal and cold, from Lord Byron's mischievously improvised song, in which he, like other observers of the time, saw clear identification between the first Luddites and our own revolutionary origins.

It begins : As the Liberty lads o'er the sea Bought their freedom, and cheaply, with blood, So we, boys, we Will die fighting, or live free, And down with all kings but King Ludd!*

Your homework:

https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/books/97/05/18/r...