ICE tells legal observer, 'We have a database, now you're a domestic terrorist'

179 pointsposted 12 days ago
by heavyset_go
(reason.com)

30 Comments

0xbadcafebee

12 days ago

We know what's next after this: they start using intel to blackmail activists into silence. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO) Worked for the SS, worked for the KGB, worked for the FBI, it'll work for ICE.

tosapple

12 days ago

Just wait until they switch us to the deutchemark.

Bitcoin doesn't work properly without power or network access extending over days though.

SpicyLemonZest

12 days ago

Blackmail them with what? It's the ICE agents who are wearing masks, because they know their life will be ruined once people discover who they are and what they've been up to.

macintux

12 days ago

Dig into their past, find indiscretions they can lean on. When you can't win the argument, discredit the messenger.

halfcat

12 days ago

Even if a person has no indiscretions, everyone has a weak point. A significant other, child, friend, job, boss, bank, etc.

bulbar

12 days ago

It's even easier today, as it doesn't even need to be true. Most people don't care about the aftermath, just about the headline.

dylan604

12 days ago

Everyone is guilty, we just haven't proven it yet.

pavel_lishin

12 days ago

> Blackmail them with what?

With murder or deportation or harassment.

SpicyLemonZest

12 days ago

Sure, but then why do they have to wait? ICE agents who want to threaten legal observers can just do it to their faces - as we've seen, even if they murder legal observers the Trump regime will have their back. I think most don't want to do that, whether out of cowardice or an understanding of what's coming once their leaders are brought to justice.

pavel_lishin

11 days ago

But there aren't that many of them. But if you make the populace afraid in advance, that's cheaper than deploying a batch of goons to every major city.

bulbar

12 days ago

They are continuously moving the goalpost. They don't know themselves what they are gonna get away with for the time being. But they will iterate themselves to whatever is the line - or don't stop if there isn't any.

vpribish

12 days ago

so extortion, not blackmail

segmondy

12 days ago

Folks in tech built that for them knowing the purpose.

dylan604

12 days ago

And those people have no qualms about doing so. We all know this. It's not like it was built in a skunk works type of back room of some unnamed branch of the gov't agencies. The conversations about the use of these tools have been ongoing for a long time.

Your comment reads as if you're trying to imply some sort of shame on those that built it. I'm guessing that instead of shame, pride is being felt on their part in the play.

user

12 days ago

[deleted]

crummy

12 days ago

The right complains that "fascist" gets thrown around on by the left so much the terms loses meaning, but soon you'll be able to say the same about "domestic terrorist".

cloverich

11 days ago

This has been a tough nut to crack, conversationally. My strategy lately has been to flip tue script: Do you think Fascism is bad? How do you define it? What would Trump need to do for you to consider him a fascist.

Its interesting to see at what point and how people try to wiggle out. Its a fun one because common counters of eg "Biden is a communist" are so easy to disassemble, ie im happy to define communist, agree it would be bad, agree we should fight against it, provide specific examples of things Biden could do to fit a communist description, etc.

It helps so far to help the right at least admit to their biased world view. not change it, but at least sort of see it.

zahlman

12 days ago

[flagged]

JohnFen

12 days ago

> (I'm accustomed to seeing Reason accused of leaning right, so it's a little disorienting to see all of this.)

We're well past these issues dividing on a left/right line. They're dividing on a freedom/tyranny line now.

akomtu

12 days ago

Colonialism is finally coming back home?

tkel

12 days ago

Who is a "terrorist" in the eyes of the US gov't has always been their political enemies, never themselves or their allies.

At this point, it's simply an empty accusation that has been so ingrained into the American psychy over generations, that it can cheaply be used to justify incredible violence against enemies of the state. Even justify invading entire countries even on faked evidence, remember the "war on terror", "weapons of mass destruction", calling Maduro a "narcoterrorist"? It's a term of propaganda, same as it ever was. Only difference now is it's more obvious as this administration doesn't seem to care if the mask is slipping.

bulbar

12 days ago

Calling foreign governments or own citizen 'terrorist' has always been two very different stories.