Ask HN: Where is society heading, is there a plan for a jobless future?

3 pointsposted 6 hours ago
by evo_9

Item id: 46734194

4 Comments

reify

3 hours ago

My understandng of UBI is that everyone gets it, rich or poor, working or not, there will be no unemployments benefits, disability benefit, or old age pensions.

In 2025 to 2026 the UK is forecast to spend £334.0 billion on the social security system payments. This will partly cover the rollout of UBI.

There will be no tax on UBI and you still get even if you work.

The "the lazy bastards wont want to work if we give them free money" crowd are wrong.

Currently people at the bottom of the lower socio-economic classes really struggle from one day to the next. They are not living, they are surviving. The evidence shows that those same poor people will work, because the extra money they earn will lift them out of poverty.

currently, if someone in the UK is claiming benefits, they are not allowed to work, if they work they commit fraud and lose their benefits. Hence, people are trapped in the benefit system. They are poor if the work and they are poor if they claim benefits.

The rich and business will have to pay more to support the structure.

The volunteer sector will thrive. I loved working as a volunteer. I did it for 10 years as a psychotherapist offering my services for free.

UBI, I hope will provide us with a pathway back to equality, civility and humanity.

fingers crossed

nacozarina

4 hours ago

there will be major wars

it will be a disorderly abandonment of the old order followed by warring factions seeking to impose an advantaged new order

eventually there are enough survivors sick of fighting that the fighting stops, day one of the new order

it has always been this way, there’s no stopping it

Bender

6 hours ago

Many white-collar jobs will be automated and those people will have to adapt and learn new skills.

We are still quite a ways away from a robot showing up to the home or business to fix plumbing along with many other blue-collar jobs. It will happen but I have no clue when or if it will even happen in my lifetime. The prototype robots that could in theory do these jobs have a lot of development, real world testing and improvements before they are commercially viable in my opinion.

Like FSD they will have to prove themselves to multiple levels of government before they are permitted to perform regulated and licensed functions. Electrician, Plumber, Civic Engineering, Certified Aircraft Mechanic, etc... There are known-unknowns that will have to be dealt with before a generic robot is permitted into a home and operate around children such as security hardening and physical safety. How much strength, bending and killing power will a generic robot be permitted to have? What is the most damage a hacker can do to adults and children via remote control of a robot? Will all robots be required to have a "safe word" that is hard wired into their firmware and a physical cut-off switch in a standard location?

There will be unknown-unknowns that pop up along the way slowing their progression. There is also the aspect of insurance and liability for generic robots operating in a commercial environment, proof of protection from IP theft, protection from take-over by competitors. There will be questions such as what is a robots responsibility if it observes a human in danger, a human breaking laws, another robot malfunctioning or harming a human and so on.

Will these robots be permitted to share everything they witness with a company and / or government? What privacy laws will exist? What happens if a robot starts to exhibit true sentience and not just mimicry of sentience like LLM's? Will their be a legal process to validate sentience? What rights will robots be afforded? Will sentient robots be given human rights? Will a marriage between a human and robot be legally recognized? If a robot breaks the law will it be punished or would that fall back to the corporation as a "industrial incident" of sorts? How will we determine the line between accident and remote assassination?

Yes I have watched iRobot way too many times and I have always enjoyed Isaac Asimov's works.

As for UBI, something has to pay for it. In the USA we already have a massive national debt and the petro dollar may not exist much longer the only thing allowing us to have such a massive dept. Do we cancel all existing welfare and related programs and consolidate them into UBI? Would that even begin to pay for such a universally applied program for hundreds of millions of people? I know people will suggest Robin Hood tactics like excessive taxes on the wealthy but that would be short lived even if it were ever approved. What would be the viable long term strategy?

Oh right, and there will still be a need for firefighters, law enforcement, medical response. Do we trust robots and their masters enough to have Robocops, ED-209's, Armadyne Corp. droids and all the other dystopian fictional robots regulating us humans? Corporations and their lobbyists make most of the laws.

fuzzfactor

5 hours ago

>Do we cancel all existing welfare and related programs and consolidate them into UBI?

Too late, they've already been consolidated in the complete opposite direction.