As time marches on, Onedrive has actively continued to blur the difference between local file storage vs storage in their cloud.

No doubt this has gotten more "seamless" in recent years than it was at first.

The exact definition of "deceptive trade practices".

>the only remaining use case for me is a gaming PC

More and more it seems people don't even find it necessary for that.

I'm "the Linux friend" for a lot of my friends, and over the last year-ish a surprising number of them have asked about advice for switching to Linux. I've helped four people attempt the switch, and three out of the four have stuck with Linux so far.

Gaming is a smaller thing for me than the Adobe creative apps, especially Lightroom.

Granted, I could get that on Macintosh. But while their fans like to claim that Apple's engineering is all about usability, that hasn't been true for quite some time. It's now become a status/elitism thing (see, e.g., yesterday's conversation about Tahoe icons). And their UX model is very contrary to my way of thinking about things.

I can't even be bothered to dual boot into Windows to game anymore. Wiped my Windows drive over the weekend so that it could be used as a snapshot drive. If the game doesn't work on Steam on Linux I'm not interested - simple as that.

This flowchart continues to be more or less accurate: https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/mx4dni/cho...

Might need a little update to bring it up to date.

Disclosure: I fear technology and my daddy is not rich.

For me it's Autocad. Although I heard people managed to run it to Linux and don't complain.

Ha... Ha haha haha... Ha!

Valve saw exactly this scenario, because you're right: Windows isn't good for stability any more. Windows isn't good for driver compatibility anymore. Windows isn't good for being easy to do your own thing. It's only good for gaming...

So: https://store.steampowered.com/sale/steammachine

> the only remaining use case for me is a gaming PC

even this has gone away for me, exited first with Bazzite and am now on CachyOS. Still got a debloated Windows11 on a different SSD for when friends want to play games with kernel-level anticheat or other bs.

feels good to be free of Microsoft. work on a Mac, game on Linux, phones run Android.

I do exactly the same as you. I wish that I didn't need windows for gaming, and things are getting better on that front, but my favorite game (AoE 2) works significantly better on windows than on wine :(

GPU drivers are legit easier on Linux than they are on windows at this point.

I mean, macOS is not a serious OS either. It has worse error management/reporting than Windows - Microsoft at least give you the courtesy of pretending they're trying to help you resolve the issue with an indecipherable hex code and badly localised error message, that you may, if you're very lucky, be able to Google.

Apple give you a middle finger with a "Something went wrong" or just spins forever. No information whatsoever on what the problem is and how you could possibly debug it. Compete lack of tooling to help with that too.

Probably my favourite example was when it was giving me an error message of "A device is using too much power, try unplugging and replugging it". Which device? Which port? What is "too much"? HA, FUCK YOU. I spent hours trying to debug this (so there is a tool that can give you power use per USB device, but it's a point in time one). In the end rewired everything because it was just impossible to discover what the hell was its problem. Another fun one was trying to extend my macOS screen to an iPad, where the button just wasn't there. Why? What was I missing? Who knows.

How many games do you use on Windows that you can not use on Linux?

I mostly agree with you. Now with proton/steamos, the only games that need windows are multiplayer games with kernel-level anticheat mechanisms (e.g., destiny 2).

Otherwise, spot-on to my MO

Set my teenage son up to dual boot his gaming rig with SteamOS this Christmas. He hasn't rebooted to Windows since...

> the only remaining use case for me is a gaming PC

Amiga users have been here before.

[dead]

Gaming will be dead soon too... Thanks to hardware shortages..

I agree here, but...

If I don't want something synced to Onedrive then I usually save it in my downloads folder or another separate folder

My complaint is that MS has intentionally made it SO DIFFICULT to do that. There's a significant amount of extra clicking and thinking necessary to go through the steps to do it.

I haven't had too many issues with it that I couldn't resolve myself, but I understood what it was and what it was doing on my system. I opted in. I wonder if most of the people who don't like OneDrive didn't know it was enabled.

> OneDrive makes it so the computers can have a 1TB hard drive

No, it's a 1TB storage account accessible via the Internet, and wholly dependent on a good Internet connection, especially if you actually use most of that 1TB. Non-tech people will take misrepresentations like this at face value, which further makes tech a disempowering force.

That's because you're using it.

The problem comes when people who don't want to use it are tricked,.manipulated, fooled and dark patterned into using it against their understanding.

The two main frustrations that I've seen encountered are:

1) Microsoft aggressively attempting to convince you to use OneDrive, no matter how many times you turn it off.

I've had a Dropbox subscription since before OneDrive became a common name, and it works for me, so I have no real use case for OneDrive. That doesn't stop Microsoft forcibly "helpfully" re-enabling the OneDrive app and embedded link in the quick access bar regularly...which leads to

2) Microsoft attempting to sync your user profile in OneDrive, and bugs that arise from how it implements that.

I've never enabled this, so I haven't dug into how it works, but the first time I ever encountered OneDrive discussion in tech or adjacent circles was people complaining about OneDrive syncing of user profile folders breaking some games.

I assume it's something like the comedy of errors that could come out of folder redirection and software not expecting multiple people touching it at once, or the comedy of conflict resolution on a filesystem layer that isn't expecting that for semantics, but I have heard more complaints about OneDrive in this context than I've heard anything else about it.

So I suspect that it works fine, if you use it as a Dropbox-alike.

Using it as a Folder Redirection/Roaming Profiles replacement, or trying to say "no" to Microsoft, is where the problems ensue.

The problem is Microsoft shoving it down our throats and making saving to local FS as cumbersome as possible.

I wouldn't have minded Onedrive, in fact I would have used it a lot more, if it just showed up as an external mounted drive in Explorer where I could just paste files and folders I want shared or backed up. But nope, Microsoft in their infinite wisdom just have to sync up my entire home directory by default and have Office/365 only save docs and sheets to cloud by default. No thank you.

The problem isn't using OneDrive. The problem is not using it. If you try to not use it, the dark patterns the article references appear.

Wholeheartedly agreed. Also the OneDrive Backup feature is great - previously people had to rely on other services (Box, Dropbox) and remember to save stuff into those folders. Now your most important Documents folder is saved in the cloud. Great. Backup! I don't think that OneDrive pestering you about buying more storage after using up your free storage is a bad thing, somebody needs to pay for stuff.

I understand the point, that everything is a bit convoluted and badly explained and may even lead to bad stuff happening. When you disable OneDrive Backup (good feature) and OneDrive deleting all your files locally with a little shortcut to OneDrive in the Cloud with all your files? Yeah... that is bad practice, but an easy fix for MS. Besides that hickup I currently don't undestand what the fuss is about.

You are conveniently ignoring the crux of the matter - that onedrive was forced on people without their knowledge or consent.

I enjoy my car, but I would dislike if someone took it without my consent and signed me up for uber instead.

Considering I've had multiple family members and friends tricked into syncing to OneDrive without meaning to, I'd say that's a big reason. My Dad's old neighbor lost the ability to send and receive email after a Windows update did that to her, since it filled up her free Microsoft account and then Hotmail stopped working so she couldn't use email anymore and she had no idea why.

You clearly understand what’s happening better than most people. As someone who came back to Windows recently after 15 years away, the lengths to which the UI goes to hide the actual location of files and prevent you from directly addressing the filesystem is incredible. Thankfully I don’t have to use Windows for anything important. I would never recommend it to anyone else. (Not that the alternatives are much better.)

What’s mainly wrong with OneDrive is that it doesn’t work how most people expect, it’s on by default, and it deletes files from your local PC without asking. No matter how nice it is if you understand what’s going on, those details are enough to make it hate-worthy IMO.

OneDrive on Windows with 6 users is probably fine.

Try adding Teams, Sharepoint and 9000 more people in the mix.

Oh and MS Office that will try to force it on you.

It's about consent and respect for the user. If you build something awesome, you don't have to shove it down peoples' throats.

When more people Google "How to disable xyz" than "How to enable xyz," that would be a strong hint to most of us, but it doesn't mean anything to Microsoft's developers. ("Hey, at least they're engaging with the product," they tell each other.)

When I see comment saying that onedrive confusing, and that people are having problems with it, I always wonder if the "hacker" crowd is really the "hacker" type they want to portrait themselves, or just inexperienced computer users bitching on Microsoft for internet points.

OneDrive is an easy and well integrated cloud drive. The principle of having a cloud drive is not new anymore, and I believe people should get over the fact that, indeed, the files on the cloud drive is... In the cloud; colour me surprised!

You can absolutely be mad at a lawnmower that cut your foot off as there isn't any scenario where your feet should be at risk during normal operation of a regular lawnmower. Unless I intentionally try to insert my foot into the blades somehow, such dangerous faults would be entirely on the manufacturer.

Now if you proceed with he same horrible lawnmower and cut off your other foot, then that might be on you.

While the analogy is being stretched, same applies here - if Microsoft makes terrible footguns, then that's on Microsoft even if the users should have stopped using Microsoft by now.

> If you're using Microsoft in 2026, that's on you.

Not necessarily. I don't use Microsoft on my personal machines, but my employer forces me to use it at work.

It's not on me, it's on my employer, which forces me to use a laptop with MS Windows installed. Sure, I ssh into a machine running Linux where I do real work, but still.

Also - lots of people are used to it and habits die hard, regardless of technical merit etc.

Microsoft is staffed by highly educated adults. They have agency to do better and actually serve their paying customers well. They choose not to.

We weren't using OneDrive at work, then we had it imposed, and everyone went through a few days period where they had to find where their documents went and/or changing the hardcoded paths in various things to match the new location.

Using OneDrive is often fine. Having it imposed on you is a breaking change.

I didn't have a problem until I migrated to another Mac. Then I started having duplicate files. I think I fixed it by logging out of everything and deleting the duplicates but it was a couple hours wasted. Didn't have this problem with Dropbox in my career.

My experience is exactly the same. I use OneDrive for easy replication of lots of stuff between my own devices, and to transfer files to friends. I've never had a lost-data problem.

On the other hand, UX for doing that sharing is clunky.

And I believe it's pretty well documented that the reason for the File-Save experience being so awful is that Microsoft is actively trying to deter us from using our own local storage, and coercing us to use their (subscription) cloud products.

The problem with this thinking is that you can never be sure these problems won’t happen to you.

I’m pretty sure it had worked just fine for the users in the article too, until it didn’t.

IMO they should clearly encourage users to keep backups elsewhere in case something happens, but they’re currently doing the exact opposite: encouraging users to back up (and on Windows even store) files exclusively on OneDrive.

Could be worse, it could be syncing to Google Photos.

Oh, you want to download all photos so that you can free the cloud space? Too bad, you can only download them one by one. Or use Google Takeout and leave half of them undownloaded.

Just curious why you would consider syncing a repo already under git? (assuming it's sync'd to github/azure/gitlab etc)

> and you will be the best desktop/laptop OS within a few years.

Arguably it's already the best desktop/laptop OS. Hopefully within a few years it can be the most popular desktop OS.

Then again... maybe this year is the year of the linux desktop...

This take is weird. Git and OneDrive in a sense both are version control systems. What do you think would happen if you created a Git repository and a SVN repository in the same folder, then proceeded to add files from .git to SVN and let SVN manipulate them? It is not OneDrive's fault that your students don't understand version control.

It's really sad if you think about that delivering the best desktop UX is all about just not actively sabotaging it on purpose.

Win the game by doing nothing while the competition drives themselves into the ground via enshittification.

After 40 years of computing this is the best we can do? No wonder we can't have nice things.

Maybe the Windows users should be called "victims" at this point.

enshittification of the NET and now OS continues. The problem is that students nowadays have very little opportunity to learn this. My daughter does not understand what a pendrive is and when the data is on her phone and when on the SD card (meanwhile sd card slots are being sunsetted in all the brands).

This is cartel to remove the data ownership possibility from people. Recently Polish youtuber got his video blocked because he showed how to play locally stored mp3 files (accused of breaking yt policy on allegedly showing people how to download illegal files)

If we allow companies to put an equals mark between not storing your own data in cloud and piracy, this will finish the cartel's objective very fast.

Well, if "great" agrees with sharing all your data with the US government, then maybe.

This happens as part of the PRISM program, whose existence was leaked by Edward Snowden last decade:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM

as part of that program, online communications and storage of all users of large US tech companies, including Microsoft, is made accessible to the NSA.

Posting this here, hoping desperately for someone to give me an example proving I'm wrong:

It's insane to me that there isn't a simple, GUI-based app that provides this utility in a clean, straightforward way. Basically just "dropbox, but let me set the destination to another drive on my PC/network/VPN (or a 'repo', for 'advanced' users)".

Just a plain interface that shows me my files and allows me to say "I want this folder to be backed up to here, here, and here". I can do that manually for every folder I want backed up, but other users may opt to backup a whole drive or whatever, depending on need.

Seems like a slam dunk. Frustrating that I don't know enough about the footguns with backups (duplications, cpu limiting, etc) to just write the app myself, but I have been looking at what the eframe and rustic libraries can do together. Feels imminently do-able by someone who has a lot of experience with backups. But maybe it's even passable do-able by someone who just knows what he wants.

The main question is who is in control not whether it is off or online. Microsoft obviously thinks that users are not, and it is Microsoft. We should have been more careful with embracing the walled gardens.

People are locked in. It's not easy to switch to another product. Even if someone is willing the pay the price for another system and pay to have the data moved and apps repurchased, they now have to learn a new OS.

Used to call that Windblows and Microsucks in my early 20s, I am not sure it was edgy back then and I am sure it isn't now. The UI/UX changes from ME > XP > Win8. At least you could keep the _classic_ look until Win10, I am not certain is the case with Win11 and what every Windows Copilot is coming next.

> uses

Are you implying each one's intended uses are different? What are the differences?

I've noticed that about Windows, that it has some sort of attachment disorder: the longer you're away from it, the more it freaks out and throws a tantrum about something the next time you boot it up. If it's been 3 or more months, you can absolutely forget about your settings staying as they were.

> As far as I'm concerned, I'm fine with these tech CTOs replacing their software engineering workforce with LLMs because the bar is already on the fucking floor when it comes to use experience.

The engineers can’t be completely to blame here, Microsoft is too consistently bad for that. It is a high-level strategy issue. Replace the Product Managers with LLMs maybe… a bunch of random matvecs couldn’t possibly be wrong so consistently, right?

Privacy Badger for Firefox blocks the TikTok. I assume there is a PB for Chrome?

>remind me to put my VPN back on

don't you mean adblock?

Boingboing used to be brilliant, I got into Doctorow through it. Absolute trash now, so sad.

Duck browser ftw

Man, I wanted to like Teams folder mounts.. what a mess.

Aside: WTF isn't the Teams wiki using markdown files you can edit and sync locally? I mean if this has changed since I last tried, cool... but that's the single biggest thing I wanted from this. Now, I just put a _docs directory into my projects and have markdown files in there sync'd to the git repo... I've given up on files in teams for the most part.

Also with teams, splitting up chats and meating chats is a pain... the "activity" indicator doesn't tell you WTF subtab for chat something is in now. I used to at least halfway like teams if you avoided (over)using features, now it's just a craptastic mess.

This story is very unclear on what exactly happened and what caused files to be "deleted". I bet on user error.

Better question: who the hell is giving these apps (or really any apps) five stars?

I don’t rate the apps I use unless other than to give it 1 star for doing something I hate. My banking app’s transaction search doesn’t work at all, so it gets 1 star. But 1.9M ratings resulted in a 5 star average — who are the freaks giving their banking app 5 stars and why?

The kind of people willing to leave stars on an app store are already a biased sample.

Mcafee for iPhone has 5 stars. iBeer has 5 stars. Every app in a search of “DMV” has five stars. Every “gpt” ai clone app has 5 stars.

onedrive app doesn't come preinstalled on your phone, or aggressively try to trick you into using it.

[dead]

Please don't fulminate or post ragey flamebait on HN. The guidelines make it clear we're aiming for better here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Yeah, I agree. Google Photos is super confusing.

Why would anybody ever want their pictures to disappear from their phone if they delete them on the web? It doesn't make any sense.

And if you don’t pay the subscription they hold your gmail hostage.

I put the effort in to move off gmail, was worth it. Now gmail is just my spam inbox

Google's Photos application is intentionally designed in such a way to hold people's files hostage. It will ask to back your stuff up on startup without the user being able to permanently disable it, with only the classic "Not now, I'm sorry my digital overlords, ask me about it next week" option being available. What will happen is that people that don't know better accept it to get it out of their way, have all their personal pictures uploaded to Google's servers where they are abused in all sort of ways (including getting a father reported to police for CSAM and permanently blocking his account for taking a picture of his son to send a doctor), and because the free plan has a limited space available but won't be respected during upload, they'll start panic-bombing the user with "All your pictures are going to be deleted if you don't pay up or clean". This is all intentional, of course: Google and its developers know the vast majority of its Android users don't know or care about all of this and will exploit that. The Gallery app doesn't have the same Google Drive constant reminder and is what I usually install when I see the above repeatedly happen on other people's devices, which is well over a dozen times now, but Photos cannot be removed, of course.

I actually switched from using Google Photos to OneDrive because the latter keeps photos as files on my system and I can view them normally in explorer rather than forcing a bespoke cloud service.

Keeping things in onedrive is fine if you want. What was not fine was moving files there without user informed consent.

OneDrive doesn't always work fine, though. I avoid it like the plague because a OneDrive screwup caused me loss of valuable data.

Was it user error? Maybe, maybe not, but that's irrelevant. If it's so easy to make an unrecoverable and catastrophic mistake, it's a tool that's too dangerous to use on the daily.

Just subscribe to this expensive service!

How about no. I dropped some important documents on a few flash drives that I have lying around.