SilverElfin
18 hours ago
What about risks from facial recognition in airports? I’m shocked how everyone just says yes and does the scan. That is going to normalize facial recognition everywhere else including rental housing.
Telemakhos
17 hours ago
How much privacy did you have in an airport to begin with? You gave your identity to the airline when you bought a ticket, and the airline passed that on to the government. You can't fly anonymously and, as far back as I can remember, never could. Even without cameras, you need a ticket to get past security, so everyone airside has already been identified. If it's an international flight, you already gave some government a biometric-friendly photograph with your passport application.
When you rent housing, your landlord is likely to require some identification for a credit check. Your face isn't going to make a difference here, because you already handed him your ID. Where it might make a difference is internal security camera footage: if you let your significant other live with you without paying rent, the landlord will know because her face will be recognized. If you sublet without notifying the landlord, he'll know. If you're running a flophouse or drug den, he'll know. But he already knew who you were before you signed a lease, because ID is more than a face.
Spooky23
17 hours ago
You had more than you think. The airport stuff gives the feds and police a high trust indexed representation of your face that will be used in all sorts of contexts in the future.
In 2025, when DOGE agents casually committed multiple felonies by exfiltrating sensitive data to god knows who, that should be really disturbing to you. Although, you see to be casually ok with some goomba landlord maintaining a dossier on anyone entering your apartment, so I guess it would be.
spwa4
3 hours ago
> Although, you see to be casually ok with some goomba landlord maintaining a dossier on anyone entering your apartment, so I guess it would be.
That might be because the goomba landlord is trying to rent you something while DOGE is part of our government who deported US citizens, completely against their own laws, to be imprisoned in a private prison, without trial, without access to family.
Therefore the goomba landlord is a small annoyance that can evolve into a small problem, and the other ...
The problem is always the same: governments see themselves as above the rules. This is why facial recognition was a big deal in the UK, until the police started to violate on a very large scale what people THOUGHT were the rules they voted in. They had failed to notice the "and violations will be checked by an independent board, so independent it's controlled by the same people controlling the police" part of the law. The government had granted itself, retroactively, without involving parliament, "an exception" (exception that covers like 98% of all facial recognition cameras in the UK) and implemented it on a large scale. PLUS from the locations and view of the cameras it is very obvious the goal is to clamp down on protests, not to stop crime.
lazide
an hour ago
Practically, I never had a chance - I walked up to passport control, and they’d already scanned me.
themafia
17 hours ago
> You can't fly anonymously and, as far back as I can remember, never could.
This is only true for commercial flights. If you charter a plane you can be as anonymous as you like.
> But he already knew who you were before you signed a lease
Add a single third party, like the police to this mix, and the problem should become apparent. Whether or not my landlord has access to this information is one problem, who they can share it and how they share it is another.
Spooky23
17 hours ago
Pre-911, you absolutely could. On my first job, a consultant had a family emergency and couldn’t fly out to a client. I met him at the airport bar, grabbed the tickets, and was on the plane 20 minutes later. This probably 1998 or 99.
My uncle serviced turbines for power plants. Power plants are often in the back of nowhere. He travelled with a few thousand dollars and a revolver into the 1970s.
sokoloff
15 hours ago
> If you charter a plane you can be as anonymous as you like
In practical terms: Not any more.
You must present a REAL-ID compliant ID as of May 7, 2025 for Part 135 (charter) flights using aircraft with maximum certificated takeoff weight over 12,500 lbs [which is almost all of them].
ID is not required for straight Part 91 flights (private aviation), though the pilot or operator has to identify all adults if the aircraft has MGTOW over 12,500 pounds and is operating under Part 91K.
You can remain anonymous if you own/borrow a plane or charter a light plane so long as you operate only from airports where TSA doesn't run the FBO security.
NBAA link: https://nbaa.org/aircraft-operations/part-135/real-id-deadli...
themafia
15 hours ago
> You must present a REAL-ID compliant ID
Only the crew is required to validate them and you're not required to pass through any TSA checkpoint to achieve this. The operator is not required to do anything other than manually verify your ID. They do not have to submit your information to any specific system.
> and is operating under Part 91K.
91K covers multiple owner aircraft, and the only implications for ID as far as I can tell, is the technical understanding of who "controls" the flight and therefore who should check the IDs.
> only from airports where TSA doesn't run the FBO security.
The TSA controls all security by law. They usually allow operators to contract with a private company to do screening. Which FBOs are the TSA immediately running security for?
sokoloff
13 hours ago
At Signature at Logan, I had to go through formal non-FBO security (including a metal detector) in our Part 91 light piston single. I’m virtually certain it was TSA (but could have been contracted).
I’ve had metal detector and uniformed security treatment at some other class Bs and even at Wheeling, WV (which was entirely out of place compared to the scale of that airport).
In any case, even if it’s just the crew that has to validate your ID, that still prevents you from traveling as anonymously as you like, doesn’t it?
randomjoe2
17 hours ago
oh wow yeah all of us are chartering planes left and right for privacy reasons, really good point man
themafia
15 hours ago
Why you would be mad at me for pointing this out and not at Congress for creating such an absurd outcome is beyond me.
staplers
17 hours ago
A semi-anonymous distant photo correlated by some gov agency (with effort) is preferable to voluntary id-verified HD facial scans uploaded as gov contracted corporate property.
hdgvhicv
18 hours ago
People don’t care. Privacy advocates have never won the battle over “nothing to hide”
ranger_danger
15 hours ago
How does one measure "winning" this battle you speak of?
hdgvhicv
5 hours ago
Getting the majority of people to actually be in favour of privacy.
staplers
17 hours ago
I’m shocked how everyone just says yes and does the scan.
SilverElfin
17 hours ago
When I opt out of TSA nonsense I have to always wait for several minutes in an odd spot like I’m some criminal. It’s certainly awkward and uncomfortable but also I feel like the delay is meant to discourage opting out.
tayo42
17 hours ago
What are you opting out of?
SilverElfin
16 hours ago
Walking through the scanner.
tayo42
15 hours ago
Didn't think that's a big deal anymore.
You can get precheck though. It makes the whole airport experience much more sane
ranger_danger
15 hours ago
It's not. But precheck comes with its own even more invasive privacy issues.
chaps
16 hours ago
Flying out of LGA once and opting out of the body scanners, while I was being patted down, another TSA agent watched from about 20 feet away and kept doing "kissy" faces at me until it was over.
c22
15 hours ago
Sounds like I'm in the minority here, but last time I flew there was a sign right next to the scanner reminding me I could opt out and I did opt out. The agent compared my photo ID to my boarding pass and professionally waved me through with no eye rolls or delay.
wahnfrieden
17 hours ago
On a recent flight the agent told me that they are changing the rule soon and will start taking you aside (potentially to a room?) for further questioning if you opt out. I didn't verify if they were telling the truth or what the current status is.
cwmoore
17 hours ago
No-fly list, no rent list, not your privilege, not my problem. /s