Apple not investing in OpenAI after all, new report says

59 pointsposted 11 hours ago
by gniting

62 Comments

mertbio

10 hours ago

This is good news. When I read the news that Apple is going to invest into OpenAI, I was a bit sad because Apple always tries to avoid to jump into the hype trains like blockchain, NFTs, metaverse etc.

Yes, there is Apple Intelligence but it is mostly writing tools, Xcode code completion, an emoji generator and so on. Nothing like something that is going to replace jobs, AGI and so on how OpenAI is marketing their products.

redleader55

10 hours ago

> Apple always tries to avoid to jump into the hype trains like blockchain, NFTs, metaverse etc.

What do you mean by "avoid ..metaverse"? They released a premium headset for AR/VR.

dagmx

3 hours ago

The “metaverse” isn’t tied to AR/VR.

The metaverse , in most common definitions, refers to a virtual world and ecosystem as an alternate for the real one. See Ready Player One.

Second life is a metaverse platform in essence. But isn’t VR.

Fortnite is a metaverse but isn’t VR. Their programming language is even called Verse.

The Quest itself isn’t a metaverse product BUT Horizon Worlds (not The confusingly named HorizonOS) is. You can participate in Horizon without a headset.

Apple has no metaverse product. There might be metaverse products on Apple devices but that’s no different than an iPhone or Mac playing the things I mentioned above.

There is almost no definition of metaverse that includes augmented reality.

hu3

6 hours ago

The knee-jerk replies you're getting are hilarious. The reality distortion field is as strong as ver. You see, because it's Apple, it can't be a bet in virtual reality with a bad connotation (metaverse). To some, Apple can do no wrong nor do they make mistakes. If they invest (and fail) in VR it was from a good angle, not purely for profit (just like Meta).

But seriously now, you can bet your left kidney that if Apple ever manages to make AR/VR work they will try to milk every penny and dime from the gullible while pretending that "it's good for you" like they do with their broken walled gardens. /rant

AnonHP

4 hours ago

Apple has been talking more about AR and discounting VR (like Meta’s grocery shopping and other “metaverse”) for many years now. Past keynote addresses as well as interviews with Tim Cook show that Apple didn’t consider VR alone as a game changer.

So far, it looks like Meta changed its view from VR-only and got into AR (with the new glasses). Apple is still pushing AR (with some VR).

Will Apple change its mind? Perhaps. That’s a good thing for companies to do in the face of new evidence/reception from the market.

threeseed

9 hours ago

Metaverse means the Ready Player One / Horizon Worlds social experience where everyone is an avatar in a shared virtual world all able to interact with each other.

Apple hasn't just not implemented this they've made it impossible for developers to as well. Because only Apple can access the sensors needed to create the 3D avatar and only Apple is allowed access to this avatar i.e. it is restricted to SharePlay with your friends.

Nevermark

9 hours ago

That isn’t the metaverse.

No dancing Zucks.

“Killer app” (as far as there is one) is focus. Being able to surround yourself with a large Mac screen & several Safari & iOS-type app screens, in a beautiful natural environment, and get real work done.

eastbound

8 hours ago

Those features are often assumed, but are NOT present in the Vision Pro.

There is only one display for apps. It’s not large. Rather tiny compared to your field of view. The features are restricted around what an iPhone can do: View photos, view movies, view your browser one tab at a time.

Immersively, yes, but anything actually productive is excluded from the Vision Pro. There is no killer app in the Vision Pro.

My 32” screen can display more windows than the Vision Pro.

kalleboo

8 hours ago

Where are you getting this from? It's not correct. You can absolutely have multiple browser windows open with different pages in them and put them all around you

sethd

7 hours ago

> Those features are often assumed, but are NOT present in the Vision Pro.

Yes they are.

Source: I develop for the device.

sealeck

9 hours ago

They haven't marketed it as "metaverse" to try to please investors, it's something they've been working on for years and have now got a working initial version they've released.

ffsm8

5 hours ago

For the record: neither has Meta/Facebook.

Their stock crashed hard after they pivoted to focus on the metaverse. It has since more then recovered - but saying that Meta marketed their VR to please investors is kinda silly considering how Mark Zuckerberg keeps doubling down on this investment to date - despite how massively the stock crashed.

ClassyJacket

9 hours ago

Metaverse isn't VR. Meta in particular just happens to be integrating them since they make both.

anileated

10 hours ago

I suspect Apple’s approach will depend on whether they see LLM integration as critical or not.

If not (which I think is the way to go, a functional purpose-built accessible UI is always better than a chatbot, and generative fluff is best left to apps) then they will go for swappable LLM backends, bypassing any legal/geopolitical restrictions. Keeps eggs diversified in multiple baskets and offers negotiation leverage (and that if Apple doesn’t find a no-frills way to pass system-integrated LLM use costs onto end users).

If yes, they will probably go full in-house. They can afford it.

Topfi

10 hours ago

> metaverse

What about the Apple Vision Pro?

mertbio

9 hours ago

In my opinion, Apple Vision Pro is a device that will eventually replace iPhone, iPad and Mac. See Meta’s Orion glasses. That’s the goal of the Vision Pro, not metaverse. It just needs some time, like 5-10 years.

nkrisc

8 hours ago

What about it? VR != Metaverse.

(FWIW I think both are way overhyped)

ryankrage77

10 hours ago

> Apple reportedly believes that the exposure the iOS 18 integration is giving OpenAI is “of equal or greater value” than cash.

So it's not just gig workers who get offered exposure to pay the bills.

Topfi

10 hours ago

Funny, though let's not forget, Google and Microsoft are willing to pay merely for default placement on Apples devices. Here, users don't even get the choice to use an alternative.

lotsofpulp

8 hours ago

Alternative for what? I don’t use default Microsoft for anything on Apple, or recall seeing anything Microsoft as a default choice.

Google was default search engine in Safari, but I changed that to DDG.

user

an hour ago

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bobongo

8 hours ago

Alternative for the AI service provider.

xena

7 hours ago

They claim that they're going to offer alternatives in the future. iOS used to have a native "share via Twitter" flow until they introduced share extensions. I imagine this will be similar.

savolai

11 hours ago

What makes openai special in comparison to its competitors that apple wants to integrate their service?

jamil7

10 hours ago

Just a guess but I think Apple was just scrambling to have a foot in the door and is likely working on gradually integrating their own Apple Intelligence services as replacements.

dagmx

3 hours ago

In Apple’s presentation they specifically say that the OpenAI integration is akin to a plugin and they may have other providers, especially for domain specific knowledge in the future.

The third party providers is smart imho. Apple take on little risk, and it allows them to avoid being reliant on any one provider.

lokimedes

10 hours ago

Apple is the most brand-aware IT company in the world. It is likely they simply recognized the synergy of partnering with the creators of “ChatGPT” that holds the mind space equivalently to “googling” but for AI among their customers.

tim333

4 hours ago

Also being brand aware would probably put it off the recent goings on at Open/ClosedAI.

JimDabell

10 hours ago

Nothing. More integrations are coming in the future and the user will be able to pick which one to use. Apple have already reportedly had talks with Google and Anthropic. They went with OpenAI first because that’s currently the best.

threeseed

10 hours ago

Google is a major investor in Anthropic.

Musk is too much of a loose cannon for Apple so Grok is out.

Mistral is in the EU which doesn't have a stable regulatory regime.

Leaving OpenAI which at least has the full support of Microsoft i.e. it will always have access to the best compute resources and endless money.

stavros

10 hours ago

> Mistral is in the EU which doesn't have a stable regulatory regime.

I guess the US's "no regulations ever" can be considered a stable regulatory regime.

jandrewrogers

10 hours ago

I think "predictable" would have been a better word than "stable" here.

atq2119

9 hours ago

The word they were really looking for was "favorable".

stavros

10 hours ago

Yeah, I guess "stable" works too, though.

anileated

10 hours ago

Making your competitor solely responsible for an important component in your ecosystem is bad news, and ClosedAI is basically an arm of Microsoft only separate to shield them from legal concerns around copyright. (And if the component is not that important, which is possibly the case with LLMs, then why spend so much money and undermine user privacy?)

terhechte

10 hours ago

They have a deep hatred for Meta, so Llama is out

yunohn

9 hours ago

Almost certainly because of the sheer popularity of the ChatGPT brand and majority of user/mind share.

daft_pink

7 hours ago

You have to feel that apple is missing out on buying into this investment as it will clearly become very valuable.

tim333

4 hours ago

The alternative is to invest the money into their own AI which will probably also become valuable.

onion2k

7 hours ago

That isn't useful to Apple though. Apple has a lot of money.

What Apple needs more than anything else is market differentiation. They need products, patents, ideas, etc that set their products apart from their competitors. Buying into OpenAI doesn't get them that (unless they outbid everyone else). Apple will be better off using their capital to invent AI of their own, or buying/investing in an OpenAI alternative.

Apple can use their market leverage to get OpenAI integration. They don't need to spend money.

SebFender

7 hours ago

As this is certainly not a money issue it may be in relation to privacy issues found by the Apple due diligence team at some point. Fixable - let's do it. Not fixable - let's move on to something else.

I was part of a few due diligence teams and the things we found sometimes broke the potential investment in less than a day in...

Nobody's perfect - but I think it's safe to say Apple makes a significant effort when it comes to privacy.

deafpolygon

11 hours ago

AI in its current state is a bubble. It's going to pop soon, and then we'll get back to business as usual.

futureshock

10 hours ago

I don’t disagree about a bubble. A bubble for promising technology is probably inevitable. But what is this about going back to “business as usual”? Now that GenAI exists it has fundamentally changed what tasks a computer is good at and which use cases are expensive vs. cheap. So there’s no going back. Even if all models stopped improving tomorrow, we’ll be adapting our products for 10 years to take advantage of this fundamental change in capabilities.

Now all that is a long way away from creating an AI god which is what the peak hypers are selling.

cubefox

7 hours ago

A few years ago saying that there will be soon AI that perfectly understands human natural language was viewed as unrealistic science fiction. Today the possibility of an AI god is regarded as unrealistic science fiction.

futureshock

6 hours ago

I keep watching old Star Trek TNG episodes and the way Data and the ship’s computer is portrayed seems to have been largely matched or even surpassed. And that was supposed to be 24th century tech that we caught up to in 35 years.

Jensson

6 hours ago

Todays models don't hold a candle to data, they are better at reading emotions yes but everything else they are horrible at in comparison.

Sci fi writers just assumed that emotions would be hard for computers but apparently it isn't that hard at all compared to rational thinking.

deafpolygon

an hour ago

We're nowhere near Data, or ship's computer, level of AI.

mjhagen

10 hours ago

I take it you mean that like the dotcom bubble? As in The Internet didn't go away, but the investors returned to a little more sensible thinking.

menzoic

10 hours ago

LLMs will continue to be used by increasingly more developers

keyle

9 hours ago

I'd agree with you except that their product is insanely good compared to the rest of the world, and they're leading into a new space as well.

Sure the bubble will pop with the hundreds of nonsense startups going on at the moment, but OpenAI will be fine.

anonzzzies

10 hours ago

Soon is what timeline? It's still getting better; as long as that happens, no one is stopping.

skerit

9 hours ago

What does this even mean, really?

blitzar

8 hours ago

Seed rounds for Ai startups with nothing more than a napkin saying "do Ai stuff" will have valuations less than a billion.

ugjka

9 hours ago

It means that the return of investment for fancy email autocomplete is not that big

retropragma

4 hours ago

Please keep the cheeky reductionist takes to yourself

user

8 hours ago

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user

8 hours ago

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fldskfjdslkfj

10 hours ago

[flagged]

user

8 hours ago

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sigmoid10

10 hours ago

So Nvidia and Microsoft are not big tech companies?

Don't mistake Apple's actions as some industry sentiment. They've always done things different. Time will tell who was right.